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Mystery DC character about to be turned gay


yojoebro82
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oh a new direction in comics. its not guess who will die no, now its guess who will be gay. storytelling really becomes a #@$#@ these days.

 

and, of course, they could never have a villain make something like a "gay-ray", because the fight to reverse the effects wouldnt be very PC.

 

 

"f" PC

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When Marvel did this 20 years ago with Northstar, it was a bigger deal because you rarely ever saw gay characters in comics. These days, we have seen our share of gay and lesbian characters and good writers didn't make an extra effort to announce to the world "This person is gay!". This is a gimmick, miserably conceived in the new 52.

 

R.I.P. to the Wally West we knew and loved. ( I am just saying it now to get it out of the way).

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I feel like they're actually making this a bigger deal then it needs to be so a character's gay who cares it's not like this is the 80s when homsexuality was frowned upon

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I feel like they're actually making this a bigger deal then it needs to be so a character's gay who cares it's not like this is the 80s when homsexuality was frowned upon

 

In a perfect world, that'd be the exact reaction: "So what?"

 

But statistically speaking the "big two" comics have significantly lagged in representing minorities of all types, particularly among "major" characters (let's face it, Northstar ain't exactly A-list).

 

It's not just gays, but pretty much anything except white males is generally greatly underrepresented among the superheroes of both universe. Yes, minority characters exist, but they generally tend to be in even smaller proportion than they are in the real population. Even women get the short end: Outside Wonder Woman there really isn't any "A-List" or "iconic" superheroine out there (Read: Someone that holds their own title for longer than a year or so at a stretch with decent to good sales and is recognized pretty much worldwide).

 

So periodically the "big two" try to demonstrate that they're not a bunch of unintentional white supremacists by "pushing" a minority character...or at least holding them up as an example so they can say "See? We're culturally aware." Opinions usually vary from, at best, "Well, it's lame but at least they're trying" to at worst "ZOMG GET YUR GHEY OUT OF MAI COMIXKS!" With the usual spectrum of folks immediately dismissing anything that isn't marketed at them as "unnecessary PC-ness." (Read: Most of the middle class white male demographic that still makes up the majority of comic buyers).

 

Oh, and I wouldn't be surprised if it IS Wally West just because of the tremendous amount of nerd-rage that will result: Any publicity is good publicity, after all, and getting a character or issue into the news means sales at the comic shop (but not in the long term).

 

Who it will NEVER be? Batman, Superman, or Wonder Woman.

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I feel like they're actually making this a bigger deal then it needs to be so a character's gay who cares it's not like this is the 80s when homsexuality was frowned upon

 

Actually it wasn't it was about the same as it is now.I had gay friends back then and nobody had to hide

 

Hell never listen to politics they make it sound like the 80's were nazi germany for gays..Ever seen the gay bar in the Police

academy movies :P

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In a perfect world, that'd be the exact reaction: "So what?"

 

But the problem here is your taking a straight character for what seems possibly 50 years or so and turning them gay

 

If it was somebody new I don't think this would such a major issue and as I said they are doing it to celebrate the idiot flip flopper in the white houses opinion on gay marriage otherwise I don't think it would of have been done

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In a perfect world, that'd be the exact reaction: "So what?"

 

But the problem here is your taking a straight character for what seems possibly 50 years or so and turning them gay

 

If it was somebody new I don't think this would such a major issue and as I said they are doing it to celebrate the idiot flip flopper in the white houses opinion on gay marriage otherwise I don't think it would of have been done

 

 

 

I don't disagree that it's silly to change an established character, but I understand DC's reasoning. You can't just "make" a prominent character. Bunker is openly gay in the new Teen Titans book and a new character, but is he a major character? Does anyone that doesn't read DC Comics or at least pay reasonably close attention to them have any idea who he is? No. Same with Northstar over at Marvel. These are C and D list characters.

 

DC's mentality is likely to try to give gay readers (which again, there are actually a pretty high number of) "their" hero. Someone they feel can prominently represent them in the fictional superheroic community. You can't just make a new character that does that, and even if they did, you and others would likely be claiming the character was being "crammed down their throat" (pardon the expression) if they tried to use him in a prominent manner in the comics/"force" him into being a major character.

 

When was the last time we had "new" characters that REALLY stuck around and became prominent to a point that they're reasonably recognized even by people that don't read comics regularly? It's a virtually impossible task because there is no "magic formula" for new characters.

 

So yeah, basically the answer DC came to is to take a character that already exists and has fans and tweak them around. Is it a good answer? No, but in this scenario there really aren't any good/perfect answers.

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In a perfect world, that'd be the exact reaction: "So what?"

 

But the problem here is your taking a straight character for what seems possibly 50 years or so and turning them gay

 

If it was somebody new I don't think this would such a major issue and as I said they are doing it to celebrate the idiot flip flopper in the white houses opinion on gay marriage otherwise I don't think it would of have been done

 

 

 

I don't disagree that it's silly to change an established character, but I understand DC's reasoning. You can't just "make" a prominent character. Bunker is openly gay in the new Teen Titans book and a new character, but is he a major character? Does anyone that doesn't read DC Comics or at least pay reasonably close attention to them have any idea who he is? No. Same with Northstar over at Marvel. These are C and D list characters.

 

DC's mentality is likely to try to give gay readers (which again, there are actually a pretty high number of) "their" hero. Someone they feel can prominently represent them in the fictional superheroic community. You can't just make a new character that does that, and even if they did, you and others would likely be claiming the character was being "crammed down their throat" (pardon the expression) if they tried to use him in a prominent manner in the comics/"force" him into being a major character.

 

When was the last time we had "new" characters that REALLY stuck around and became prominent to a point that they're reasonably recognized even by people that don't read comics regularly? It's a virtually impossible task because there is no "magic formula" for new characters.

 

So yeah, basically the answer DC came to is to take a character that already exists and has fans and tweak them around. Is it a good answer? No, but in this scenario there really aren't any good/perfect answers.

 

I understand what you're saying and I respect it.

 

What I'm not down with is editors saying "We need more characters that are _______ " (And this ______ can really be anything but ususally it has something to do with being PC or filling a quota or an agenda). So the company doesn't have as many ________ characters as they'd like. Well, instead of introducing NEW _______ Characters, which I, and I imagine anyone else here would have no problem with, they have to take established, popular characters, change them, tweak them, alter them to the point where they tick off fans and contadict their OWN STORIES, just for the sake of filling a quota. "But hey, at least now the character is ______ and we can tell bold new stories", says the editor. Sorry, not on board with that.

 

(Again, the above is assuming we're talking about Wally West here. Who's bee straight and married for years).

 

I realize there are no prominant gay heroes. If that's a problem then work to change it. And for God sake give the fans something other than the crutch of being gay to make people think he or she is interesting. How lame is North Star? He always HAS been. He'd be lame gay or straight (In fact, if he were straight he'd probably be killed off long ago). Give the modern Star Man a big push (I think he's gay...) involve him in a major story ark, showcase why people should think he's cool. He won't be Instantly Popular Gay Superhero like they're looking for, but the integrity of the stories will be in tact.

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In a perfect world, that'd be the exact reaction: "So what?"

 

But the problem here is your taking a straight character for what seems possibly 50 years or so and turning them gay

 

If it was somebody new I don't think this would such a major issue and as I said they are doing it to celebrate the idiot flip flopper in the white houses opinion on gay marriage otherwise I don't think it would of have been done

 

 

 

I don't disagree that it's silly to change an established character, but I understand DC's reasoning. You can't just "make" a prominent character. Bunker is openly gay in the new Teen Titans book and a new character, but is he a major character? Does anyone that doesn't read DC Comics or at least pay reasonably close attention to them have any idea who he is? No. Same with Northstar over at Marvel. These are C and D list characters.

 

DC's mentality is likely to try to give gay readers (which again, there are actually a pretty high number of) "their" hero. Someone they feel can prominently represent them in the fictional superheroic community. You can't just make a new character that does that, and even if they did, you and others would likely be claiming the character was being "crammed down their throat" (pardon the expression) if they tried to use him in a prominent manner in the comics/"force" him into being a major character.

 

When was the last time we had "new" characters that REALLY stuck around and became prominent to a point that they're reasonably recognized even by people that don't read comics regularly? It's a virtually impossible task because there is no "magic formula" for new characters.

 

So yeah, basically the answer DC came to is to take a character that already exists and has fans and tweak them around. Is it a good answer? No, but in this scenario there really aren't any good/perfect answers.

 

I understand what you're saying and I respect it.

 

What I'm not down with is editors saying "We need more characters that are _______ " (And this ______ can really be anything but ususally it has something to do with being PC or filling a quota or an agenda). So the company doesn't have as many ________ characters as they'd like. Well, instead of introducing NEW _______ Characters, which I, and I imagine anyone else here would have no problem with, they have to take established, popular characters, change them, tweak them, alter them to the point where they tick off fans and contadict their OWN STORIES, just for the sake of filling a quota. "But hey, at least now the character is ______ and we can tell bold new stories", says the editor. Sorry, not on board with that.

 

(Again, the above is assuming we're talking about Wally West here. Who's bee straight and married for years).

 

I realize there are no prominant gay heroes. If that's a problem then work to change it. And for God sake give the fans something other than the crutch of being gay to make people think he or she is interesting. How lame is North Star? He always HAS been. He'd be lame gay or straight (In fact, if he were straight he'd probably be killed off long ago). Give the modern Star Man a big push (I think he's gay...) involve him in a major story ark, showcase why people should think he's cool. He won't be Instantly Popular Gay Superhero like they're looking for, but the integrity of the stories will be in tact.

 

 

But once again...how much can they push a gay character to the forefront before the same people complaining about turning an established character gay are complaining that "this gay character is getting shoved down our throats because of some PC bullcrap?" It's kind of a no-win situation for the Big 2: You create a new character of a minority background and try to push them, and most of the fandom rejects them, their book doesn't sell well (even though it's often critically acclaimed), and then gets cancelled and the character goes into limbo. Make an old character gay and you run into the same problem from a different angle. The real problem is that much of the entrenched comic reading fandom is deathly afraid of change and horrendously close-minded to new ideas even while they claim they want them. I'm not speaking of anyone in specific here, it's just the general trend overall. It's why no one can stay dead, "classic" costumes (and the people occupying them) always come back, and ultimately Superman will never end up with anyone besides Lois Lane for a "real" girlfriend in the long term.

 

I don't want it to be Wally, and I think it's a stupid idea to make it Wally, but I WOULD note that with the "new 52" all of Wally's old stories, his marriage, and his kids can (and probably are going to even if he's remaining hetero) be erased. In effect, this would be a new character with the same name, look and powers as Wally West. Wally's old history was erased with the reboot like everyone else's was, though some characters kept more of it than others, that was mostly reserved for Batman and Green Lantern. The "Original Titans" generation looks to have been de-aged and had most of their backstory gutted so that they're not so old as to be infringing on the "first generation" heroes again, and the "current teen" generation looks to have been de-aged a bit too...even if they'll all run into the same problem again in about 5-10 years). Bah...whatever, I haven't ready monthly comics in years.

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It's kind of a no-win situation for the Big 2: You create a new character of a minority background and try to push them, and most of the fandom rejects them, their book doesn't sell well (even though it's often critically acclaimed), and then gets cancelled and the character goes into limbo.

 

I'll go one further and say that is the fate of most ANY new character.

 

Even if they do get thier own title, what is it? 30 issues before the shine wears off? 4o issues? If it's an old character with this problem they just renumber it starting with #1. If it's a newer character, then they just go away. Can you name any relatively new characters with their title numbering in the 100s or 200s? Nope. The big 2 will always be most faithful to the old guard heroes and jettison any newbies that don't work out. Comics suck now.

 

Man, judging by the lack of gay talk in this post, I think I'm running out of gas for this topic. Oh well...

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It's kind of a no-win situation for the Big 2: You create a new character of a minority background and try to push them, and most of the fandom rejects them, their book doesn't sell well (even though it's often critically acclaimed), and then gets cancelled and the character goes into limbo.

 

I'll go one further and say that is the fate of most ANY new character.

 

Even if they do get thier own title, what is it? 30 issues before the shine wears off? 4o issues? If it's an old character with this problem they just renumber it starting with #1. If it's a newer character, then they just go away. Can you name any relatively new characters with their title numbering in the 100s or 200s? Nope. The big 2 will always be most faithful to the old guard heroes and jettison any newbies that don't work out. Comics suck now.

 

Man, judging by the lack of gay talk in this post, I think I'm running out of gas for this topic. Oh well...

 

Most new character titles don't even make it past 12 issues.

 

I'd say the last "successful" time period for "new characters" was the late 80's/early 90's. The dominance of the X-Franchise gave us Gambit, Deadpool, Cable, and (on the villain side) Apocalypse. Sabretooth was an older character, but got a massive boost once they decided he was Wolverine's arch-enemy, so he almost counts, too. Venom first appeared in the Spider-Franchise. On the DC front the "third generation" kicked in about the same time: Tim Drake, Bart Allen, Cassie Sandsmark and Kon-El/Conner Kent, who have generally stuck around.

 

Since then? Winter Soldier is pretty popular and has the potential to "stick" but he's not technically a "new" character. Miss Martian seems pretty popular between the comics and the Young Justice cartoon. But that's about all I can think of from the last 10-15 years or so.

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Most new character titles don't even make it past 12 issues.

 

I'd say the last "successful" time period for "new characters" was the late 80's/early 90's. The dominance of the X-Franchise gave us Gambit, Deadpool, Cable, and (on the villain side) Apocalypse. Sabretooth was an older character, but got a massive boost once they decided he was Wolverine's arch-enemy, so he almost counts, too. Venom first appeared in the Spider-Franchise. On the DC front the "third generation" kicked in about the same time: Tim Drake, Bart Allen, Cassie Sandsmark and Kon-El/Conner Kent, who have generally stuck around.

 

Since then? Winter Soldier is pretty popular and has the potential to "stick" but he's not technically a "new" character. Miss Martian seems pretty popular between the comics and the Young Justice cartoon. But that's about all I can think of from the last 10-15 years or so.

 

Thunderbolts had a nice good run from the mid 90s until now. Made it 174 issues. It almost restored my faith that a group of new, interesting characters could make it in modern comics.

 

Next month the book turns into another Avengers comic :(

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Does anyone finds it funny that ppl care if a male superheroes turns out gay, but not a female superhero? Double standards much?

 

 

Most not all straight males like girl/girl I don't know of a straight guy who wants to see two men kiss.I have nothing against gays but I don't want to see them kiss even if it was drawn

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Thunderbolts had a nice good run from the mid 90s until now. Made it 174 issues. It almost restored my faith that a group of new, interesting characters could make it in modern comics.

 

Next month the book turns into another Avengers comic :(

 

But Thunderbolts was also another case of "old characters getting a new coat of paint." Kinda like X-franchise Sabretooth (originally a "street level" villain!) or Winter Soldier. There were very few truly "new" characters in the bunch and once again...most of the new ones didn't stick around all that long (Jolt, Charcoal, Dallas Riordan).

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This stupid idea didn't work for Batwoman and it certainly won't work for an existing character. When stuff like this happens it just has the smug air of an agenda to it and it will not only go flat it will go sour completely.

 

I know I won't be reading it just because of the change, I can't relate and I find it offensive. I personally can get along with anyone and have cousins who are gay but there is a fine line in how I can relate to them and I just can't on many levels. I love them and would do the same for them as any of my other cousins but they have a lifestyle that I find uncomfortable with have no desire because of religious beliefs to understand and support.

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Remember when comics used to be fun? Sure, there were some back stories, like Wolverine wanting Jean but Jean loved Scott triangle, Gambit & Rogue, even Superman & Lois Lane, but the soapy stuff was always in the background, and at the heart of a story was a simple "good vs. evil" action-packed fun-filled comic.

 

All for diverse teams and characters who work together for the good of all, but man, General Hospital and Melrose Place couldn't hold a candle to what goes on in the books today.

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well the question is how can new ones stick around? they die or change names or dissapear after 12 issues anyway. i liked spoiler then she was batgirl and now dissapeared. look at the new blue beetle. a lot went wow when they showed him. i bet a year or two later he was dead and now he is back with his own serie? what the? most fans allready know how it will happen and dont go into new characters because of that. then the gay thing. i doubt that a comic will sell so much more just because a character is gay. if wally is the chosen one then flash fans will check it out. no matter what. i doubt that dc will write "the first major gay character has his own comic now" on the cover. they will sell it as "wally is back". so it makes no sense if you ask me.

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Well, apparently Dan Didio has said that it is NOT Wally West.

 

This may well be a case of the publisher overhyping how "major" their character is. The only other truly "iconic" hero that (technically) hasn't been re-introduced yet is Captain Marvel/Shazam. Otherwise if we're talking Earth-2 characters (Alan Scott, etc...) it's not likely many people are going to care that much.

 

And seriously guys, let's not start acting like once this character pops up it's going to be "all gay, all the time." Even Apollo and the Midnighter were rarely shown engaging in much PDA, and they were as "out" as they get.

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