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Robots in Blackface


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The characters are portraying any of the white-boy wannabe gangsters that infect our youth everywhere. The MTV generation. Pimp My Ride and that... So, yeah, that particular stereotype, NOT race, is stupid and makes for silly movie characters. Skids and Mudflap are not "blackface", they're an unfortunate and very common group of youngsters that exist in society.

 

Is Transformers anti-black? Just look at Sgt. Epps, Tyrese's character in the movie. Complete opposite of Skids and Mudflap. Strong, respectable, smart, heroic. C'mon people.

 

Quit getting your nuts in a twist over a summer popcorn flick and go put your energy into a REAL issue.

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Okay seriously??? your an idiot and you need to grow up already! it wasent like Bay intentionally put the robots in there to poke fun at african americans i mean come on for the most part african americans who watch the film are laughing along with everyone else in the theater and I know because when I went and saw it every person in that theater was laughing and noone complained about the roborts. Also there is a reason why the movie is rated pg-13 that means that if a parent decides they want to bring their child that is younger then thirteen then they should know that there is stuff in the movies that is inappropirate for children younger then that age so if you decided you wanted to bring your child to see the movie you shouldent be complaining you should have known already what the movie would have in it. I find it very annoying when people take a small thing like this and take it way out of context and ruin an amazing movie by complaining about it. If you dident like the movie then keep your trap shut and let other people create their own opinions!

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well I crtainly glad that i'm not the only one who believes that subtel forms of cloaked racisum still have a major impacked on todays society. The dude is very correct. people of all ages will be much more prone to buy in to these types of sterotypes and accecpt them them either on a consicience or subconsicence level.

 

You know with all the flack the Jazz death caused you would have thought Bay would have been more mindful of stuff like this. As far as i concserned this is proof that Bay is a crass jerk that fails his audiance............thats it the audiance that does'nt watch Nas car!

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The characters are portraying any of the white-boy wannabe gangsters that infect our youth everywhere. The MTV generation. Pimp My Ride and that... So, yeah, that particular stereotype, NOT race, is stupid and makes for silly movie characters. Skids and Mudflap are not "blackface", they're an unfortunate and very common group of youngsters that exist in society.

 

Is Transformers anti-black? Just look at Sgt. Epps, Tyrese's character in the movie. Complete opposite of Skids and Mudflap. Strong, respectable, smart, heroic. C'mon people.

 

Quit getting your nuts in a twist over a summer popcorn flick and go put your energy into a REAL issue.

 

i beg to differ. Sgt Epps was indeed ZANNY and over the top. or do i need to quote that clever lil scene.......how's it go again........LEFT CHEEK LEFT CHEEK!!!!!!!! That was just one of the endless exmples of white people getting a sence of entertainment from "THOES WILD FUNNY BLACK PEOPLE".........ha........ha..........ha..........ha

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Okay seriously??? your an idiot and you need to grow up already! it wasent like Bay intentionally put the robots in there to poke fun at african americans i mean come on for the most part african americans who watch the film are laughing along with everyone else in the theater and I know because when I went and saw it every person in that theater was laughing and noone complained about the roborts. Also there is a reason why the movie is rated pg-13 that means that if a parent decides they want to bring their child that is younger then thirteen then they should know that there is stuff in the movies that is inappropirate for children younger then that age so if you decided you wanted to bring your child to see the movie you shouldent be complaining you should have known already what the movie would have in it. I find it very annoying when people take a small thing like this and take it way out of context and ruin an amazing movie by complaining about it. If you dident like the movie then keep your trap shut and let other people create their own opinions!

 

 

so your saying just because the movie has pg13 rateing we the audiance should expect robots who's "disguise" is a lame ass black face sterotype?? sorry but i dont think black face strotyping should be one of the things you would be expecting to sheild your kids from.

 

which brings me to my next point. the movies rateing is moot as far as i'm conserned. I don't think racisum get a "green light" at ANY AGE!!

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The characters are portraying any of the white-boy wannabe gangsters that infect our youth everywhere. The MTV generation. Pimp My Ride and that... So, yeah, that particular stereotype, NOT race, is stupid and makes for silly movie characters. Skids and Mudflap are not "blackface", they're an unfortunate and very common group of youngsters that exist in society.

 

Is Transformers anti-black? Just look at Sgt. Epps, Tyrese's character in the movie. Complete opposite of Skids and Mudflap. Strong, respectable, smart, heroic. C'mon people.

 

Quit getting your nuts in a twist over a summer popcorn flick and go put your energy into a REAL issue.

 

i beg to differ. Sgt Epps was indeed ZANNY and over the top. or do i need to quote that clever lil scene.......how's it go again........LEFT CHEEK LEFT CHEEK!!!!!!!! That was just one of the endless exmples of white people getting a sence of entertainment from "THOES WILD FUNNY BLACK PEOPLE".........ha........ha..........ha..........ha

 

Ignore the guy since he might be a troll especially how he only has one comment.

 

Besides, his name can be either based on the Beast Machine character, Savage/Noble or the racist belief from the 18th? century where people from a tribal civilization (that hasn't been touched by European culture) are those who:

 

Lives in harmony with nature.

Lives without war or violence.

Lacks guile or deceit.

Possesses uncanny physical health and senses.

Has an innate wisdom and spiritual connection

 

Essentially it is a myth towards Native American and African tribes that weren't introduced to western culture

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Okay seriously??? your an idiot and you need to grow up already! it wasent like Bay intentionally put the robots in there to poke fun at african americans i mean come on for the most part african americans who watch the film are laughing along with everyone else in the theater and I know because when I went and saw it every person in that theater was laughing and noone complained about the roborts. Also there is a reason why the movie is rated pg-13 that means that if a parent decides they want to bring their child that is younger then thirteen then they should know that there is stuff in the movies that is inappropirate for children younger then that age so if you decided you wanted to bring your child to see the movie you shouldent be complaining you should have known already what the movie would have in it. I find it very annoying when people take a small thing like this and take it way out of context and ruin an amazing movie by complaining about it. If you dident like the movie then keep your trap shut and let other people create their own opinions!

 

*Puts his debate hat on

 

So because those of African descent have laughed at the comedic parts in the film makes it okay? From what you said, it seems that as if the African American audience in the theather you watched the movie at rep. the entire African American community.

 

The problem with racism is that they tend to be inserted in cartoons and movies to get laughs from adults and kids. Cartoons today even have some racial easter eggs that you may or may not catch. For instance, the WB kids cartoon "Xhangai Showdown" is littered with asian stereotypes whereas the lead is a short chinese kid who thinks women are inferior to men. Those who makes movies and such may not be aware that it is considered offensive. For instance, other than skin colour, think of the first thing that pops up in your head when you hear "asians" or "latinos."

 

I bet some of those might be racial stereotypes. American culture is based on describing people through stereotypes especially in TV. For instance, racism is sometimes used for the audience to relate to the lead better. I think that if Hollywood goes with a minority as a lead,they would be believe that the audience would think of the film as foreign or "too ethnic" and would not watch it. Racial diversity is a new thing within our society so it would be a long time till Hollywood finally has characters that aren't based on racial traits.

 

I like your last sentence on the subject since you said that people should shut up about things they don't like about a movie so others can create their opinion on the matter. I mean, so you are telling that if I don't like a movie, I can't state my opinion on it yet someone who loves the movie can, which would I assume would make some to believe they also like the movie? It doesn't make logical sense to me since not liking a movie is also an opinion and we as Americans have the right to state our opinion.

 

If you don't like someone's opinion, then it is okay because we all like different things.

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Oh, look. Another politically correct alarmist looking for a reason to be offended.

 

You really expect people to believe that the filmmakers looked at this movie at some point and said, "Hey, you know what this project needs? Racism!" Incredible. Good luck surviving in the real world when movies obviously give you a nosebleed.

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l love how former postless posters come out of the w00dw0rk just to post something through insults.It seems like these ppl wait till there is a controversy so that they can use the word "idiot"

 

They probably getting paid by Bay or a bunch of Bay brown nosers... They been showing up across the boards everywhere defending him as if he was their daddy...

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Oh, look. Another politically correct alarmist looking for a reason to be offended.

 

You really expect people to believe that the filmmakers looked at this movie at some point and said, "Hey, you know what this project needs? Racism!" Incredible. Good luck surviving in the real world when movies obviously give you a nosebleed.

 

It doesn't have to be intentional to be racist. The author said:

 

Yeah, those are the voice actors, and Bay is the director. Either he didn’t know what he should have known, or he knew and did not care. Either way he violated the trust of Hasbro, Paramount, and any parents with the misfortune to expose their children to this thinly guised racism.

 

(emphasis mine)

 

He *should* have known; however, it's unlikely that he realized Skids and Mudflap were racist caricatures. Instead, he thought they were funny. Why? Because he has those stereotypes built-in to his subconscious as "funny" and it came out in his vision of the Transformers. In the same way that the movie speaks volumes about his own sexist stereotypes and prejudices.

 

Just because he's too racist himself to notice how wrong and offensive the characters are doesn't give him a pass for doing it. Probably the most prevalent and the most malevolent racism in America now is this kind of racism - the kind of racism that people insist isn't even happening or doesn't exist, no matter how blatant it may be, because there's some sort of "excuse" for it - like Bay's pathetic "But they're robots, not people!" excuse.

 

Having one African American character in the movie who is reasonably well-done and well-liked also does not undo the fact that he still thought dehumanizing an entire race with a robot blackface caricature was funny.

 

When I saw the movie, I didn't need to look for a reason to be offended. I was trying to enjoy myself, and for the most part I did. However, I was sickened by the portrayal of these characters, which only got worse the more screen time they were given. It reminded me of some of the very worst, most racist/imperialist portrayals of Caliban (from Shakespeare's The Tempest).

 

ETA: I only have one post because I normally post over on Tformers. :D

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I just want to point out in reference to this bugs bunny cartoon that it was indicative of the times. The bugs bunny cartoons are a slice of history. A taste of the culture at the time. I don't think they should be restricted viewing any more than I think the little rascals should be. Also, white people were made fun of at least as much as anyone in those cartoons. Look at Elmer fudd, an overwight bumbling idiot with a speech impediment. Yosimite Sam also got the short end of the stick. I haven't seen transformers yet, but I think comparing any type of what you call racial stereotyping today to the cartoons of early to mid last century is like comparing two completely dissimilar things. A Boeing 747 to an orange.

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Probably the most prevalent and the most malevolent racism in America now is this kind of racism - the kind of racism that people insist isn't even happening or doesn't exist, no matter how blatant it may be...

 

Caricatures are supposed to be funny. They're supposed to be exaggerations. I don't see these as "racist" stereotypes as much as "cultural" stereotypes, and there's a significant difference. I can't help thinking that those most offended by the caricatures are those who fit the stereotype to a T.

 

Thanks to the alarmists, an entire generation of film-goers was introduced to Stepin Fetchit when they first saw Jar Jar Binks. What should have just been another goofy character turned into a race issue for George Lucas. As much as people want racism buried in the past, these knee-jerk PC police keep digging it back up.

 

Case in point; not long ago, a concerned grandmother wrote to a greeting card company because her granddaughter had received a Barbie™ Valentine's Day card in school that read "Valentine, you shine!" Unfortunately the verse accompanied an image of an African-America Barbie doll and the term "shine" is an outdated (but apparently not entirely forgotten) disparaging term for a black person. Never mind that the dress the doll was wearing was covered in shiny sequins. Never mind that, had the doll been any other color, it would have been perfectly acceptable. The greeting card company was going to be accused of being racist because no one on their staff – full-time or freelance – thought to run the term "shine" through Microsoft's Offense Check™.

 

Ignorance is indeed bliss, yo.

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Probably the most prevalent and the most malevolent racism in America now is this kind of racism - the kind of racism that people insist isn't even happening or doesn't exist, no matter how blatant it may be...

 

Caricatures are supposed to be funny. They're supposed to be exaggerations. I don't see these as "racist" stereotypes as much as "cultural" stereotypes, and there's a significant difference. I can't help thinking that those most offended by the caricatures are those who fit the stereotype to a T.

 

That's right; I'm offended by revolting racist stereotypes because I'm so dumb I can barely read (just like Skids and Mudflap). Yet I referenced postcolonial Shakespearean literary motifs in my post. Interesting juxtaposition, there.

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I honestly did not see the characters as stereotypes of African-Americans... I saw them as stereotypes of urban youth, particularly inner city gangs, which can be comprised of any race. Here in Arizona, it's not uncommon to see the same behavior of Hispanic-Americans, as well as caucasians. Check out many hip-hop videos from the past 10+ years, and the lifestyle is glorified. If anything, I found it funny because it shows how silly "thugs" look when they think they're being cool. It wasn't a racial stereotype, it was a lifestyle and personality stereotype.

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Now who's playing into stereotypes?

 

That's right; I'm offended by revolting racist stereotypes because I'm so dumb I can barely read (just like Skids and Mudflap).

 

Exactly what made you think these two characters were dumb? Did you get that just from the way they sounded? And if not, had they sounded "white" (whatever that is), would it have justified they way they acted?

 

I'm guessing a couple of illiterate hillbillies would have been just fine, but when it comes to urban youths, suddenly it's "racist."

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Now who's playing into stereotypes?

 

That's right; I'm offended by revolting racist stereotypes because I'm so dumb I can barely read (just like Skids and Mudflap).

 

Exactly what made you think these two characters were dumb? Did you get that just from the way they sounded? And if not, had they sounded "white" (whatever that is), would it have justified they way they acted?

 

I'm guessing a couple of illiterate hillbillies would have been just fine, but when it comes to urban youths, suddenly it's "racist."

 

You have got to be kidding. You couldn't tell they were lacking in intelligence? How about the fact they admitted they were illiterate or could barely read? They were bumbling, out of control, disruptive clowns. To get any more specific, I'd need to see the movie again. They really reminded me of some of those awful clips from the Bamboozled compilation, though.

 

If they looked and sounded white and were still stupid, I wouldn't consider it racist. Why? Because white people aren't a minority in America and white people weren't enslaved by black people for hundreds of years, followed by another hundred years of systematic oppression.

 

I think you could easily still make a couple of "illiterate hillbillies," as you say, very offensive characters. It doesn't carry the same sort of historical, cultural and social burden as racism, but can still be offensive. I wouldn't rule out the possibility that Michael Bay could make offensive stereotypes of various forms. Skids and Mudflap just happen to be particularly egregrious.

 

African Americans in this country have to succeed despite racist stereotypes constantly. Young black people have parents who experienced Jim Crow. For many people, Juneteenth this year was a tremendously important event (i.e. through Congress' action to finally apologize for slavery and Jim Crow). Seriously, it took until 200-freaking-9 to apologize for that? The government has officially apologized to many other ethnic minorities for abuses perpetrated by the government (for example, Native Americans). When you and/or your parents and/or your grandparents have grown up with cultural apparitions of "white superiority/black inferiority" in pretty much every facet of life, it damages the self-esteem and self-worth of an entire race of people. Sliding backwards by having some more funny racist stereotyped characters damages the progress that has been made and is wrong, shameful, and harmful. Directing it at children is especially reprehensible.

 

Living with a recent history of systematic oppression and racism is part of the psyche for such groups of people. It is that much harder to overcome when it's still a part of pop culture and is passed off as nothing more than a joke.

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You have got to be kidding. You couldn't tell they were lacking in intelligence? How about the fact they admitted they were illiterate or could barely read? They were bumbling, out of control, disruptive clowns. To get any more specific, I'd need to see the movie again. They really reminded me of some of those awful clips from the Bamboozled compilation, though.

 

If they looked and sounded white and were still stupid, I wouldn't consider it racist. Why? Because white people aren't a minority in America and white people weren't enslaved by black people for hundreds of years, followed by another hundred years of systematic oppression.

 

I think you could easily still make a couple of "illiterate hillbillies," as you say, very offensive characters. It doesn't carry the same sort of historical, cultural and social burden as racism, but can still be offensive. I wouldn't rule out the possibility that Michael Bay could make offensive stereotypes of various forms. Skids and Mudflap just happen to be particularly egregrious.

 

African Americans in this country have to succeed despite racist stereotypes constantly. Young black people have parents who experienced Jim Crow. For many people, Juneteenth this year was a tremendously important event (i.e. through Congress' action to finally apologize for slavery and Jim Crow). Seriously, it took until 200-freaking-9 to apologize for that? The government has officially apologized to many other ethnic minorities for abuses perpetrated by the government (for example, Native Americans). When you and/or your parents and/or your grandparents have grown up with cultural apparitions of "white superiority/black inferiority" in pretty much every facet of life, it damages the self-esteem and self-worth of an entire race of people. Sliding backwards by having some more funny racist stereotyped characters damages the progress that has been made and is wrong, shameful, and harmful. Directing it at children is especially reprehensible.

 

Living with a recent history of systematic oppression and racism is part of the psyche for such groups of people. It is that much harder to overcome when it's still a part of pop culture and is passed off as nothing more than a joke.

 

Wow, you're just as racist. What's worse is you sound very educated but you still live in ignorance.

 

'If they looked and sounded white and were still stupid, I wouldn't consider it racist. Why? Because white people aren't a minority in America and white people weren't enslaved by black people for hundreds of years, followed by another hundred years of systematic oppression.'

 

Word for word, that paragraph is so racist it hurts. So if white people are displayed via a negative stereotype, it's ok and not racist?

 

Last I checked, 'white' encompasses germans, english, swedes, etc. And minority is a term used a group that it is in the minor. Considering after 'white', 'blacks' come SECOND after 'whites' followed by hispanics, asians, etc.

 

Also, get your facts straight. Do you know who captured your ancestors and sold them into slavery to the 'whites?' OMG, that's right, other 'blacks.' So in essence, if you want to cry foul over that, blame your ancestors for being part of a village that was conquered by someone of the SAME skin color as you yourself.

 

Lastly, systematic oppression? You know why racism won't die? Because YOU and anyone else who screams RACISM won't let it. Take a look at England. Slavery existed there but do you see them screwing each other over because of skin color? Not really. You know why? They don't talk about it nor does anyone act as though they are entitled to something based on their heritage.

 

As soon as Americans realize that no one is entitled to anything and life is what one makes it, then the country will move forward. As long as anyone preaches inequality of any kind (positive or negative), Americans will forever have to deal with this.

 

Racism is taught. Plain and simple. It's taught on both sides.

 

One final note: African America isn't on a map and doesn't exist. You're Americans, just like the rest of us. Get over it and move on.

 

NOTE: This was written by a true American. He was adopted and doesn't know the origin of his race, etc. This is just fine because I am who I am regardless of the color of my skin or what my ancestors dictate of me.

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Yeah, I just don't see this thread lasting very long.

 

Personally, I take the "Twins" as Michael Bay's very personal FU to the people that were upset/offended by Jazz in the first Transformers movie: "Now I'm going to make them even -more- stereotypical and let them live, to boot! Take that, fanboy losers!"

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I'm going to say it, this is crazy!

 

Anyone who thinks there is racism here is crazy.

 

I'm not trying to be a bad guy here, just simple voice of reason.

 

A black comic on stage spending most of an hour long routine on making fun of white people ISN'T racist unless it's meant to convey hate. Nobody ever makes a big issue out of that, nor do I. I don't care unless the joke isn't funny. What does bother me is the double standard.

 

Now we're not talking about some blatant bashing of anyone here, nor was there anything in there pointing out and saying...see they act like this because all black people do!

 

Anyone finding offense here, is LOOKING for it! Pure and simple.

 

Skids and Mudflap reflect a culture, not a race.

 

Let me say that again...A CULTURE not a race! The rap/hip hop culture has been embraced by people of ALL races, and I consider these characters to be based off that, NOT black people as a race. I don't see the need to say African-American because not black people consider themselves African as a Jamaican born friend explained to me.

 

If you look around, you see a culture of young people who are black, white, Asian/oriental, Arab, Hispanic...you name it that have been highly influenced by and very much emulate the rap/hip hop culture. IT'S A FACT!

 

To add to that you have large urban areas with those mixes of people who grow up themselves in an environment where they associate more with different races on a daily basis, and naturally adopt the same mannerisms and behaviors of those around them.

 

So I say again, it's a cultural thing not a racial thing.

 

To take a racial offense over these small things, I'm sorry if it offends some for me to say, is getting really selfish and petty. Society as a whole needs to quit trying to compartmentalize everything down to me, me, ME! Whether it's on a personal level or things like this on a larger scale.

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You know why racism still exists? its because of crap like this. everyone has to find something to be offended by, why? because they are the true racists. Stereotypes are more then often false, and I know perfectly well that the majority of the black community is not like what was portrayed, and no one thinks they are. so stop this complete and utter stupidity. Its stuff like this that makes me respect people less and less.

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