Why are the Jedi...

[pesatyel]

lol really guys? its STAR WARS it shouldn't be taken seriously in the first place as to why there weren't more powers in stuff int he movies my theory(ies) - special effects cost money... a lot of the powers would look kinda silly live action--ie super speed-- the healing thing? palpatine healed vader long enough to pimp him out in black leather and metal....

 

read some of the EU novels. the jedi are pretty KA in those. as well as the video games... force unleashed anyone muahahahhaha

 

that's why I excluded those "side" things cause they couldn't be easily reconciled with the core material.

 

Either the Jedi were, basically, pushovers using their status and "awe factor" instead of REAL power or they were kick as ninjas who were portrayed as having to much/many powers.

 

And, speaking of the games, they HAD to include additional powers. What fun would it be to play if you only had 3 (mind trick, telekinesis and light saber)?

 

What I was looking for was something more representative of WHY the Jedi were considered, I dunno "special" or, as I said above "awe (or fear or whatever) inspiring". I just didn't really get a sense of any such thing in the movies except for a few quick things here and there (such as Vader deflecting Solo's lasers as mentioned above).

 

 

Funny how Luke who had a crash course into being a Jedi could sense Vader and these Jedi Masters couldn't sense Palps

 

There are a lot of ways to explain that, using the story (as opposed to "the script said so"). Luke and Vader had a familial connection, both in Vader being the guy who murdered his father and then BEING his father.

 

Vader wasn't totally evil like Palatine was.

[clonekiller72]

About the jedi abilities an why they can seem powerfull enough to lift starships one second and not a hovercar later. Remember Yoda was in hand to hand combat at the time. He probably had abilities like a Force shield, enhance ability (dexterity), lightsaber combat enhancements, force speed, danger sense, ect. Each layered power decreases the ability to pool the force for the telekinesis ability.

However, when not engaged in direct combat a Jedi can call upon force concentration to increase his force ability pool which would allow massive telekinesis events like moving starships. But should an attack occur while using this ability even Yoda would be prone to attack.

The thing that isn't clearly seen in the movies or cartoons is the fact that many abilities are being used in a very subtle form. From the aforementioned combat layers that make the jedi major combatants, to Obi's use of a "illusonary" sound to scare off the sand people, to the Force astrogation Luke used to get to Dagobah, to the force senses used to detect Vaders search for Luke at Endor, all of these are differnt abilities.

 

If you are really interested in force abilities, you should check out the Star Wars Role Playing Game, it has alot of cool info on how the Jedi abilities work.

[pesatyel]

About the jedi abilities an why they can seem powerfull enough to lift starships one second and not a hovercar later. Remember Yoda was in hand to hand combat at the time. He probably had abilities like a Force shield, enhance ability (dexterity), lightsaber combat enhancements, force speed, danger sense, ect. Each layered power decreases the ability to pool the force for the telekinesis ability.

However, when not engaged in direct combat a Jedi can call upon force concentration to increase his force ability pool which would allow massive telekinesis events like moving starships. But should an attack occur while using this ability even Yoda would be prone to attack.

The thing that isn't clearly seen in the movies or cartoons is the fact that many abilities are being used in a very subtle form. From the aforementioned combat layers that make the jedi major combatants, to Obi's use of a "illusonary" sound to scare off the sand people, to the Force astrogation Luke used to get to Dagobah, to the force senses used to detect Vaders search for Luke at Endor, all of these are differnt abilities.

 

If you are really interested in force abilities, you should check out the Star Wars Role Playing Game, it has alot of cool info on how the Jedi abilities work.

 

That's just it, they HAD to include "more" abilties in an RPG (or in the video games and such). It would be pretty boring with only 3. But the question is, why didn't they do that kind of thing in the prequels?

[clonekiller72]

They are in the prequels. I'm watching Episode II on Spike right now, and these skills are all through the movie, and all the preqels for that matter. If anything these "extra" abilities were created after the original trilogy, cause the RPG's have been around since the mid 80's.

 

Check out an online listing of force abilities, then watch the prequels. These abilities are all over them.

 

Force sense, force speed, emptiness, life sense, danger sense, translation, beast control

 

While not called out, these abilities are subtlly used.

[pesatyel]

They are in the prequels. I'm watching Episode II on Spike right now, and these skills are all through the movie, and all the preqels for that matter. If anything these "extra" abilities were created after the original trilogy, cause the RPG's have been around since the mid 80's.

 

Check out an online listing of force abilities, then watch the prequels. These abilities are all over them.

 

Force sense, force speed, emptiness, life sense, danger sense, translation, beast control

 

While not called out, these abilities are subtlly used.

 

 

Subtly? I was watching too....

[Sentinel Prime]

Hm. Interesting thread.

 

Don't forget the Jedi have kind of a "Spider-Sense" with the Force.

 

Also, I'd like to point out the the Jedi typically act as cops, in all of the thousands of years NOT seen in the movies. They act against people without abilities. To someone who isn't a Jedi, or a highly trained mega bad-ass, the Jedi probably would seem like super-heroes. Even the droids don't pose a threat unless the droidekas come rollin' in.

 

In the films the Jedi are put up against those with, what by all means appears to be, greater strength.

 

It's funny to me that people are questioning Palpatine's strength levels....the movie all but spells out how insanely powerful this guy is. It's clear in the films he is cloaking himself, and one way that is effective is that the entire galaxy is being thrown into the dark side. There's death and chaos everywhere, and it's clouding the force to the Jedi, and they can't even fully access their powers, specifically with sensing and foresight.

 

Some would say that his post-Windu face is his real face all along. When fighting Windu, he lost the strength to maintain it, and kept his true face to manipulate the public and Anakin, so they would think he was disfigured from the attack and get sympathy. Seriously, this is how deep this guy's plans could be. His grand plan was actually one of the only really great things about the prequels, it's just that Lucas botched the telling of it.

[Devilbat]

I agree Daredrummer; and where ya been man?! (lol) Seems like I haven't seen you around here in ages...

 

Palpatine's multi-layered plot is the genius part of the prequels. It's just that some of the rest of the story like you said is a little rough around the edges at times. And I too agree in your theory that Palpatine always looked hideous, that his confrontation with Mace Windu just caused him to give up the disguise of a normal person. How convenient that he had the Force-lightning-to-the-face alibi to fall back on. Whether or not that's what Lucas intended, I'm not sure. I do know that Ian McDiarmid was quoted in the Star Wars insider at one time as explaining Palpatine's twisted look as just that; that Palpatine really looked hideous and that the Chancellor Palpatine look was the disguise, like he could actually use the Dark Side to physically alter his appearance, which is a infinitely cool power in my mind and a great new layer to the potential of the Dark Side. I was always really satisfied with that explanation, and you've echoed that Daredrummer. I would just like to know for sure if that's what Lucas intended.

[pesatyel]

I agree Daredrummer; and where ya been man?! (lol) Seems like I haven't seen you around here in ages...

 

Palpatine's multi-layered plot is the genius part of the prequels. It's just that some of the rest of the story like you said is a little rough around the edges at times. And I too agree in your theory that Palpatine always looked hideous, that his confrontation with Mace Windu just caused him to give up the disguise of a normal person. How convenient that he had the Force-lightning-to-the-face alibi to fall back on. Whether or not that's what Lucas intended, I'm not sure. I do know that Ian McDiarmid was quoted in the Star Wars insider at one time as explaining Palpatine's twisted look as just that; that Palpatine really looked hideous and that the Chancellor Palpatine look was the disguise, like he could actually use the Dark Side to physically alter his appearance, which is a infinitely cool power in my mind and a great new layer to the potential of the Dark Side. I was always really satisfied with that explanation, and you've echoed that Daredrummer. I would just like to know for sure if that's what Lucas intended.

 

 

That's a lot of insight. I think you guys are giving Lucas more credit than he deserves when it comes to Palaptine though. I think the idea had more to do with the perspetion that fans would be confused as to why the Emperor looked all old and twisted while Palpatine looked (relatively speaking) young and healthy. I think the same applies to Anakin loosing his arm. You have to SHOW how/why it happened.

 

But talk of the Sith doesn't really show much either. As I understand it there are only ever TWO Sith (a master and an apprentice). I guess you could say there are only ever THREE since you could technically have a "Padawan" to the apperentice. This is, I think, meant to imply that the Sith are incredibly powerful (and Palpatine's ability to cloak himself from ALL the Jedi at the same time would, somewhat, bear that out), but ARE they? Or is it more the IDEA of the Sith being a really nasty bogeyman type then real power?