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25th Anniversary complaints


Phanstar

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Ok. I've warmed up a lot to these 25th anniversary figures. There are quite a few things I really like about them. However lets face it, these figures are not perfect. Especially not all of them. Am I the only one that has complaints about this line? Other than availability?

 

First off it seems we still have one of the biggest problems since the JvC relaunch. Weapons won't stay in hands. This is terribly bad in almost every figure I've opened. Sigh.

 

In some cases I honestly feel there is too much articulation. Like with Cobra Soldiers, for some reason all the added articulation doesn't add to the realism but instead just makes the figure appear gangly or unnatural. Maybe its just me. It doesn't seem to affect all the figures, just certain ones.

 

Another big complaint I have is even with all the added articulation, "the most articulated joe figure ever", I still find it difficult if not impossible to put most of these figures in realistic, or some of my favorite poses. Poses that RAH, and New Sculpt figs could accomplish easily. For example, Standing, holding a gun in their right hand, with the back of the gun tucked under their right arm, pointing it out... virtually impossible. Its weird but even though they have more points of articulation it seems their range of movement is far more limited. This combined with the sometimes gangly look of the figures creates a lot of weird and akward cheap looking poses.

 

 

Anyways there are some of the figures I love and they seem to keep getting better. But what is up with Aces face? He looks like some bizarre acid trip.

 

Snake Eyes V1 is AWESOME. Frostbite is FANTASTIC. I have several faves... So I'm not all hate.

 

:)

 

Phanstar

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Some of the points of articulation don't even work well, like the ball-jointed heads for example. There's virtually no movement up and down, and if that's the case, why not just go back to swivel necks? Don't even get me started on the Duke arms they're so keen on using again and again...

 

Honestly though, my biggest problem (again, now that I've seen Major Bludd) is reused molds.

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The Duke arms are probably used ad nauseum for one reason: they are exceedingly cheap to produce...

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THERE NOT ORING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. as the new body has the lack of moving like the oring did. the duke arms are fine if they gave him shorter hands.

these are not customize friendly maybe if they had a screw in the back it would but to have to break apart the chest to switch out arms sucks as i have broken every chest that i have tried. so i dont customize the 25anny figs. i just use them as parts or keep them as they are.

 

the best part is all the removable gear. and working holsters. pluse all the great detail .

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Yeah, what xhairs said...

 

The 25th figures are basically supposed to be more of a "put-in-a-display-case-and-look-pretty" line of figures instead of ones that have any kind of rugged play value. This, unfortunately, is one of the down sides to collectors demanding "more realistic/articulated/updated/better/yada yada yada" versions of toys they grew up with years ago. The results can sometimes end up being very nice-looking, but ridiculously fragile and nearly useless in playsets or vehicles.

 

Case in point...I'm currently working on an "updated" version of the Rattler so that the 25th Anniversary Wild Weasel has something to cruise around in. I've had to do extensive work on the pilot's seat just to get him to fit, due to his bulky hip holsters. These figures were never really intended to be used with vehicles, etc. Though, Hasbro HAS heeded the call and reworked a few of the classic ARAH vehicles to use with them, but that may have been an afterthought.

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More detailed yes, but more articulated no. They may have more points of articulation, but as I said earlier, the range of motion on most of these is way less. Like DPrimes head example. I understand these toys are meant for display more than play which is fine, thats all I want. But still its hard to display them when you cant even pose them in a standard im pointing my rifle at you pose. Or even get them to hold their rifle for that matter.

 

I will totally agree that the extra detail is sweet in most of the figures, and I LOVE the holsters with actual removable pistols. The throwback to the vintage joes with uniform/style/packaging. Honestly I wish I had never opened my first one, because I think these would look absolutely best displayed Mint On Card. There is a lot of hit and miss. Flint blah. Serpentor?!? WOAH. Anyways... I would definately say even the worst 25th anniversary figures are WAY better than the original T hook Joe Vs. Cobra figures, and many are way better than the later New sculpts we got.

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the duke arms are fine if they gave him shorter hands.

 

They're not though - haven't you tried posing him holding his weapon naturally, with two hands? The elbow joint is crap on those arms.

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No, they aren't O-Ring.

 

However, they DO use a similar body construction, sans O-Ring. When Scarlett came out, someone took her apart and proved that.

 

However, beyond that, there is NO reason they can't have articulation at least equal to that of RAH. The continued complaints about Duke's arms is a perfect example. EVERY (ok almost every, lol) RAH figure could move the arm a full 90 degrees.

 

25th Duke and several other figures cannot. Why? Are the 25th arms structured SO different from RAH arms? I can't see how. Aesthetic qualities? Hardly. Compared to 82/83/84, etc. maybe, but a lot of the later figures had quite a bit of arm details. Even then, the joints are going to break the aesthetics anyway. That's why the moved from swivel bicep to swivel elbow. And even THAT worked. The later DTC figures all had them. And they have full RAH articulation. So what the hell happened?

 

The heads? The problem iwth them is they aren't centered properly. A human head is more centered on the neck than what we see here. Gung-Ho is a good example. His face is HUGE compared to the neck and the rest of his head. They are like they used the model for Stan Smith from American Dad to design the heads.

 

The new body design is ok, I guess, lol (I still haven't opened any yet). I think the problem with the body is that it throws off the accessories. Look at Firefly. His webgear is all bunched up around his neck. The other is the torso. No reason they couldn't use the same design as RAH there either.

 

 

The legs. I don't mind the double jointed legs.....IF they did it universal. How hard was that? The problem I have is the feet. Thse hinged ankles are going to wear out fast. And the foot peg isn't going to help. Why is the hole in the MIDDLE of the foot instead of the sole? That's going to weaken the ankles a little too.

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the duke arms are fine if they gave him shorter hands.

 

They're not though - haven't you tried posing him holding his weapon naturally, with two hands? The elbow joint is crap on those arms.

 

no your right i forgot i shaved the upper arms to get the 90 angles . i think this was a way better try from most of the other lines we got since JvC but i think the o ring and better molds to give us the full 90 we want to improve on this line.

 

but i dont think we will ever get the 100% figs we want so with the 25 anny we get 90% and i guss thats why i customize to get them to a 100% lol. #US1#

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I'm all for the 25th anniversary line and I don't complain too much about it. I know its not perfect but it sure as hell beats the GI Joe vs Cobra, Spy Troops, Valor vs. Venom and the DTC lines that were offered in the past.

 

At least Hasbro is doing us collectors all a favor and giving us something because we could just be getting nothing.

 

People have to realize that the 80's are OVER I repeat, "O-V-E-R". The original GI Joe design team of the 80's are no more. Those people could have moved up in the Hasbro company, retired from Hasbro, quit Hasbro, or they could be dead.

 

And also people have to realize that GI Joe is a toy it is impossiable to make something dead on and perfect. The RAH lines had its issues too and I don't see people complaing too much about it.

 

And also the 25th anniversary line is mainy for display, not play so if your playing w/ these figures at a age of 25 - 40yrs old then you have problems.

 

And one more thing if people are going to talk trash about the 25th anniversary line then then DON'T BUY THEM, I repeat, "DON'T BUY THEM"

 

I understand that everyone is entitled to his/her opinions but keep them to yourself.

 

And also take note that too much bitching could lead to an early death of this line because, Hasbro does visits and reads these forums and if all they read is nothing more than just complaints they will kill this line and bring back should I say, SIGMA SIX . And who wants that?

 

Do I make myself clear?

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I'm all for the 25th anniversary line and I don't complain too much about it. I know its not perfect but it sure as hell beats the GI Joe vs Cobra, Spy Troops, Valor vs. Venom and the DTC lines that were offered in the past.

 

That is very true.

 

People have to realize that the 80's are OVER I repeat, "O-V-E-R". The original GI Joe design team of the 80's are no more. Those people could have moved up in the Hasbro company, retired from Hasbro, quit Hasbro, or they could be dead.

 

And also people have to realize that GI Joe is a toy it is impossiable to make something dead on and perfect. The RAH lines had its issues too and I don't see people complaing too much about it.

 

:blink: Blasphemy! RAH was perfect... Well, until Cobra La and BF2000, then it started to go downhill...

 

And also the 25th anniversary line is mainy for display, not play so if your playing w/ these figures at a age of 25 - 40yrs old then you have problems.

 

Well, articulation is essential to display. I must admit as a kid I wished my RAH figures could hold their weapons with both hands. I didn't complain too much because it was so much better than any of the other toylines out there (oh how I wished SW was built RAH-style back then). Now, though, I don't think it's too much to ask for. I don't "play" with my figures but I like displaying them realistically - it sucks that you can do this with some of the figures but not all - where's the standardization?

 

And one more thing if people are going to talk trash about the 25th anniversary line then then DON'T BUY THEM, I repeat, "DON'T BUY THEM"

 

I don't think that's the right approach - strong sales in the SW line meant that there'd be a better chance you'd get a better, more articulated version. Look at the VOTC figures. I'll buy Major Bludd in the hopes that they'll make a completely new sculpt version down the line. I did it with Duke, SS and SE V2, and Serpentor too.

 

I understand that everyone is entitled to his/her opinions but keep them to yourself.

 

That's a load of crap. If you don't want to read about opinions what are you doing on a forum?

 

And also take note that too much bitching could lead to an early death of this line because, Hasbro does visits and reads these forums and if all they read is nothing more than just complaints they will kill this line and bring back should I say, SIGMA SIX . And who wants that?

 

Whatever... Sales determine everything. If anything collector bitching led to them going back to the original RAH character designs.

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I'm all for the 25th anniversary line and I don't complain too much about it. I know its not perfect but it sure as hell beats the GI Joe vs Cobra, Spy Troops, Valor vs. Venom and the DTC lines that were offered in the past.

 

At least Hasbro is doing us collectors all a favor and giving us something because we could just be getting nothing.

 

People have to realize that the 80's are OVER I repeat, "O-V-E-R". The original GI Joe design team of the 80's are no more. Those people could have moved up in the Hasbro company, retired from Hasbro, quit Hasbro, or they could be dead.

 

And also people have to realize that GI Joe is a toy it is impossiable to make something dead on and perfect. The RAH lines had its issues too and I don't see people complaing too much about it.

 

And also the 25th anniversary line is mainy for display, not play so if your playing w/ these figures at a age of 25 - 40yrs old then you have problems.

 

 

im a TRU kid ill never grow up i play with my toys lol. displaying is playing and dios are playing so most of us our still kids at heart. #US1#

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I'm all for the 25th anniversary line and I don't complain too much about it. I know its not perfect but it sure as hell beats the GI Joe vs Cobra, Spy Troops, Valor vs. Venom and the DTC lines that were offered in the past.

 

At least Hasbro is doing us collectors all a favor and giving us something because we could just be getting nothing.

 

People have to realize that the 80's are OVER I repeat, "O-V-E-R". The original GI Joe design team of the 80's are no more. Those people could have moved up in the Hasbro company, retired from Hasbro, quit Hasbro, or they could be dead.

 

And also people have to realize that GI Joe is a toy it is impossiable to make something dead on and perfect. The RAH lines had its issues too and I don't see people complaing too much about it.

 

And also the 25th anniversary line is mainy for display, not play so if your playing w/ these figures at a age of 25 - 40yrs old then you have problems.

 

And one more thing if people are going to talk trash about the 25th anniversary line then then DON'T BUY THEM, I repeat, "DON'T BUY THEM"

 

I understand that everyone is entitled to his/her opinions but keep them to yourself.

 

And also take note that too much bitching could lead to an early death of this line because, Hasbro does visits and reads these forums and if all they read is nothing more than just complaints they will kill this line and bring back should I say, SIGMA SIX . And who wants that?

 

 

 

Why does every thread with constructive critisism and an actual discussion about the attributes of an action figure have to attract one of these posts? Wow. I'm gonna respond to this against my better judgement. Hasbro is doing us a favor to make a product and sell it to us at a nice profit? Sounds like business. A favor is when I call my neighbor and borrow his tools and pay him nothing.

 

Yes the 80's are over.

 

I really don't think it is asking too much to want an action figure that can hold his gun in his hand without a rubber band or glue.

 

Also, I hardly think our conversation here is going to kill the toy line forever.

 

 

Now back to reality. What is everybodys two favorite and Two worst??? I haven't gotten the whole set yet, but they are on their way but from the ones I do have, I must say my favorites are Snow Job, and V1 Snake Eyes. Honorable mention to Gold Face Destro. Least faves are Serpentor and FLint, honorable mention to Cobra Soldier.

 

Looking at those picks leads me to believe the line is definately improving.

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Well, I don't know what product some of you folks have, but the few 25th figures I have blow the RAH stuff out of the water.

 

The issue of sturdiness is the same here for me: both RAH and 25th figures have potential issues.

Some of the 25th figures can be seen as flimsy, but how many RAH figures suffered thumb and crotch breaks in due course?

Sounds like the same argument there.

 

As far as articulation goes.......I gotta hand Hasbro this one--these are more articulated than before--and its the little things that do it.

 

I'll pick two figures, just for the sake of discussion here: Beachhead and Crimson Guardsman--both figures that were modified by Hasbro to have hips that allow them to kneel or sit, leaving behind the flaws of the first 5 packs.

Now, I've owned the original RAH versions of these two and I have a favourite pose for each that I tried with the 25th versions. Its a semi-crouch, with weapon shouldered ( at ready) held in the right hand and supported by the left hand.

In the case of the 25th figures, they hit this pose better.........far better that the RAH figures ever could.

Here's why: There's three key POA's that are used, two of which the RAH figures LACK.

They are: wrist swivel, double-hinged knees, and ball-jointed ankles.

Those three POAs allow the poses to be more natural with the 25th than they are with the RAH figures.

Add to that the slight head tilt, torso joint and hips--all of which CAN be emulated to a degree with either one, and the 25th simply poses better.

I can get the rifles with the CG shouldered right up to where he can sight down it properly, with Beachhead, he's still looking a bit further alongside, but its closer that I could do it with the RAH figures.

There's ZERO concern for snapping off a thumb with the 25th guys in this, something that happened with both figures ( spares) I had with the RAH stuff.

The wrist swivel POA alone makes the shouldered rifle pose possible, something no RAH figure features.

I can get the 25th figures to solidly hold the foregrip OR the aft-end of the grip, right near the magazine--something very few RAH figures can pull off naturally.

 

It is true the degree of incline on the elbows is not as pronounced on the 25ths as it was on the RAHs, but there's a definite sweet spot that can get almost.........almost as much incline on a 25th.

Again, the poses I can hit look natural--and given the detail and "better" proportions on these figures make them more interesting to my eyes.

 

The argument here ( about POAs) falls down to the 25th figures simply having a few more POAs that given them a advantage posing. They have more detail, I think they have far better proportions, and more interesting features.

There's no argument saying that the "RAH figures would be just as posable with the wrist swivel etc"--because none of them ever came that way. Its like saying the Moon really WOULD be mighty tasty if it were really made of cheese.......hey, its not worked out that way.

 

What the debate comes down to is preference.

Its not about " this product is better, therefore YOUR product is lesser.......and so are you".

 

Its simply that some folks prefer the 25th figures and some do not. Sounds like its simply a case of two entrenched camps that are reluctant to give up their positions. To paraphrase an old saying I've heard: " there are no rights or wrongs here, only discoveries".

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Well, I don't know what product some of you folks have, but the few 25th figures I have blow the RAH stuff out of the water.

 

The issue of sturdiness is the same here for me: both RAH and 25th figures have potential issues.

Some of the 25th figures can be seen as flimsy, but how many RAH figures suffered thumb and crotch breaks in due course?

Sounds like the same argument there.

 

As far as articulation goes.......I gotta hand Hasbro this one--these are more articulated than before--and its the little things that do it.

 

I'll pick two figures, just for the sake of discussion here: Beachhead and Crimson Guardsman--both figures that were modified by Hasbro to have hips that allow them to kneel or sit, leaving behind the flaws of the first 5 packs.

Now, I've owned the original RAH versions of these two and I have a favourite pose for each that I tried with the 25th versions. Its a semi-crouch, with weapon shouldered ( at ready) held in the right hand and supported by the left hand.

In the case of the 25th figures, they hit this pose better.........far better that the RAH figures ever could.

Here's why: There's three key POA's that are used, two of which the RAH figures LACK.

They are: wrist swivel, double-hinged knees, and ball-jointed ankles.

Those three POAs allow the poses to be more natural with the 25th than they are with the RAH figures.

Add to that the slight head tilt, torso joint and hips--all of which CAN be emulated to a degree with either one, and the 25th simply poses better.

I can get the rifles with the CG shouldered right up to where he can sight down it properly, with Beachhead, he's still looking a bit further alongside, but its closer that I could do it with the RAH figures.

There's ZERO concern for snapping off a thumb with the 25th guys in this, something that happened with both figures ( spares) I had with the RAH stuff.

The wrist swivel POA alone makes the shouldered rifle pose possible, something no RAH figure features.

I can get the 25th figures to solidly hold the foregrip OR the aft-end of the grip, right near the magazine--something very few RAH figures can pull off naturally.

 

It is true the degree of incline on the elbows is not as pronounced on the 25ths as it was on the RAHs, but there's a definite sweet spot that can get almost.........almost as much incline on a 25th.

Again, the poses I can hit look natural--and given the detail and "better" proportions on these figures make them more interesting to my eyes.

 

The argument here ( about POAs) falls down to the 25th figures simply having a few more POAs that given them a advantage posing. They have more detail, I think they have far better proportions, and more interesting features.

There's no argument saying that the "RAH figures would be just as posable with the wrist swivel etc"--because none of them ever came that way. Its like saying the Moon really WOULD be mighty tasty if it were really made of cheese.......hey, its not worked out that way.

 

What the debate comes down to is preference.

Its not about " this product is better, therefore YOUR product is lesser.......and so are you".

 

Its simply that some folks prefer the 25th figures and some do not. Sounds like its simply a case of two entrenched camps that are reluctant to give up their positions. To paraphrase an old saying I've heard: " there are no rights or wrongs here, only discoveries".

 

The argument is that, while the figures have several features that are IMPROVEMENTS on RAH bodies, there are several points that are WEAKER than RAH. How do you attempted to improve on a product yet the end result doesn't completely incorporate the original product's capabilties? Like taking an AM only radio and adding FM capability but reducing the bandwith for the AM part for no reason. Simply put, there is NO reason these can't have the same minimal capabilties of a RAH figure, even taking into account the new torso design and merely ADDING to it.

 

Also, maybe its a nitpick, but where do the NEW Joes fit? They aren't technically RAH (if you use the defination that RAH is 80s/90s only), but they DO use that body design. And there were several figures that included the various body designs. Night Creeper had both swivel wrists and hinged ankles. Recondo had swivel wrists and swivel ankles. Mutt and Barrage had more centered heads (I'll have to double check though). Barrage and Torch had "25th style" arms but with more articulation.

 

Really, the only thing missing from the Night Creeper is the double hinged knees and he'd be a "25th" analog. And THAT bears in mind, not ALL the 25th figures even HAVE that!

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I'm all for the 25th anniversary line and I don't complain too much about it. I know its not perfect but it sure as hell beats the GI Joe vs Cobra, Spy Troops, Valor vs. Venom and the DTC lines that were offered in the past.

 

That is very true.

 

People have to realize that the 80's are OVER I repeat, "O-V-E-R". The original GI Joe design team of the 80's are no more. Those people could have moved up in the Hasbro company, retired from Hasbro, quit Hasbro, or they could be dead.

 

And also people have to realize that GI Joe is a toy it is impossiable to make something dead on and perfect. The RAH lines had its issues too and I don't see people complaing too much about it.

 

:blink: Blasphemy! RAH was perfect... Well, until Cobra La and BF2000, then it started to go downhill...

 

And also the 25th anniversary line is mainy for display, not play so if your playing w/ these figures at a age of 25 - 40yrs old then you have problems.

 

Well, articulation is essential to display. I must admit as a kid I wished my RAH figures could hold their weapons with both hands. I didn't complain too much because it was so much better than any of the other toylines out there (oh how I wished SW was built RAH-style back then). Now, though, I don't think it's too much to ask for. I don't "play" with my figures but I like displaying them realistically - it sucks that you can do this with some of the figures but not all - where's the standardization?

 

And one more thing if people are going to talk trash about the 25th anniversary line then then DON'T BUY THEM, I repeat, "DON'T BUY THEM"

 

I don't think that's the right approach - strong sales in the SW line meant that there'd be a better chance you'd get a better, more articulated version. Look at the VOTC figures. I'll buy Major Bludd in the hopes that they'll make a completely new sculpt version down the line. I did it with Duke, SS and SE V2, and Serpentor too.

 

I understand that everyone is entitled to his/her opinions but keep them to yourself.

 

That's a load of crap. If you don't want to read about opinions what are you doing on a forum?

 

And also take note that too much bitching could lead to an early death of this line because, Hasbro does visits and reads these forums and if all they read is nothing more than just complaints they will kill this line and bring back should I say, SIGMA SIX . And who wants that?

 

Whatever... Sales determine everything. If anything collector bitching led to them going back to the original RAH character designs.

 

 

I have to agree with pretty much all you said dprime. In addition, these figures are aimed towards collectors, but they ARE meant for kids too. The articulation is part of the selling point. If it wasn't imporant, kids would get Corps figures or the Justice League statutes (THOSE are considered "action figures" yeah, right).

 

And I'll also add that we all know Hasbro is here and listens. They aren't complete morons and they do know how to filter crap from good ideas, just like anyone else. "Bitching" about it DOES produce positive results. I cite the 2002 JvC figures that were T-Crotched. A lot of negative fan feedback/reaction got Hasbro to hold back on figures like Scarlett to convert them back to O-Ring. They could have canceled then, but didn't.

 

Another example is 25th Beach Head. One significant complaint about the 25th figures was the crappy crotch design. They listened and made changes. Beach Head came with both, hence the example, and you can't tell me the slimmer crotch isn't better (can you? lol). The point is, people bitched about it so they did what they could to fix things. Not all the way, of course (the Crimson Guard came out after and has the bad crotch).

 

As for the example of Sigma Six, the line had way too many problems (and a horrid cartoon), IMO. Size and price point being significant.

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I must admit I do not as of yet have Beach Head or Crimson Guard. However it sounds like that pose you speak of is very similiar to the pose I try to achieve with many of my 25th figures and struggle. It just seems to me that while they may bend in the same places, a lot of times 25th figures dont bend as FAR in the same places, making simple poses a major nuisance if not impossible.

 

I do like the figures. I like them a lot. They added detail and throwbacks to vintage are very fun, and very neat to display.

 

I am however very dissapointed in a lot of them. Some were so bad in the first wave I would have stopped buying them if my brother in law hadn't kept snagging them up for me without asking if I needed them.

 

I still haven't gotten most of those figures from him so keep in mind most of my opinions are based on the earliest figures. Especially in Wave 1 the figures were very hit and miss. I loved V2 Stormshadow, V1 Snake eyes. Both fantastic figures. I thought Hooded CC was pretty good. But in the midst of these I got stinkers like Flint, and Cobra Soldier who not only had the wrong color symbol, but a pretty gangly odd look to him. It made me pretty unsure about the line. So I wondered... Am I the only one that doesn't think this line is perfect?

 

Hence the thread.

 

Phanstar

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I understand that everyone is entitled to his/her opinions but keep them to yourself.

 

I know it's early, but this statement is a prime favorite for "Most idiotic thing I've read all year."

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That was my complaint too and the reason why i've yet to buy any. I got the GI Joe five pack for Christmas they LOOK great. I couldn't asked for better LOOKING figures, but you can't play with them and to me, a toy you can't play with is just a waste of money. I'll give it another chance when the DVD sets come out. I hope the future sets on the way fix this.

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That was my complaint too and the reason why i've yet to buy any. I got the GI Joe five pack for Christmas they LOOK great. I couldn't asked for better LOOKING figures, but you can't play with them and to me, a toy you can't play with is just a waste of money. I'll give it another chance when the DVD sets come out. I hope the future sets on the way fix this.

 

 

That's the Catch-22 I think. "Most Articulated Ever" when in some ways they don't even match RAH standards. There was another argument about, since they are geared towards collectors, collectors don't "play" with them.

 

WTF? If collectors didn't "play" with them in SOME way (even just posing ontop of a shelf) they could just sell them as statutes (kinda like the Justice League figures). Why even BOTHER with articulation?

 

Which goes to say also, the kids have to like them too.

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