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Stephen Sommers to direct GI Joe Movie....


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OR HOW ABOUT A SILVER "PAINTED" VIN DIESEL AS DESTRO-------LMAO

 

 

DOC

 

 

 

agrabsheader1.gif ugh!

 

There's so much potential for campy and cheesy...it's just TOO scary!

 

 

My point exactly.....the Mummy movies were entertaining to me.....but for GI Joe I am terrified. It will be GI Joe through his eyes....somewhat.

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Apparently you have not really read the marvel comic.

 

 

Oh please, I own every issue of the Marvel run. Let's look at it as it is.

 

 

Oliver stone would actually be a good choice. But I'm more inclined to suggest a newer director who's familiar with DARK fantasy type EPICS: Timur Bekmambetov of Night Watch.

 

Yes I did say dark and GI Joe is a very dark story about how a government machine helped orchestrate the creation of Americas first major domestic terrorist organization. The story of cobra commander is sad and his son is messed up. the story of snake eyes is depressing, Storm shadow is a glimmer of hope, and Zartan represents man willing to redeem himself. Destro exposes how corrupt our government is and the Jugglers are just proof that corporations really run the world.

 

 

 

A dark story? With a guy cloaked in a hood, running around with gay-pride candidates ( including a guy in a BIRD outfit and a chap who sleeps with crocodiles!) using giant robotic walkers coming out of the sea, nanobots and all manner of sci-fi weapons?? I see a pretty whimsical story in all that........its pretty far-fetched to begin with--dark wouldn't serve any of that..........simply because NONE of that is dark.

 

 

Larry Hama wrote some of the most amazing drama in a world of futurism and sci fi technology, with character as colorful as they were dangerous.

 

Hama is lauded as this great writer............but again, let's look at things as they are. He's NOT a great writer--in fact, he's pretty sloppy a lot of time. Reading all those Marvel comics I have I can see a great deal of utter BS in military things that were supposed to be researched. Not art things, but dialogue and character bits that are horribly wrong or cliched.

Here's two examples: Some GIJOE team member hgead over to the UK and met up with some SAS guys--who are prim-proper "say wot, cheerio!" tan-beret wearing Brit cliches. Had Hama done some simple reasearch, reading Tony Geraghty's prominent book on the regiment, he'd have known that SAS operatives tend towards being scruffy types, permitted to have lax grooming standards because of the nature of their work. They'd also not be driving up to the lads in a jeep wearing wooley-pulleys and tan berets.

Hama flubbed that one.

A second: when Stalker and Stormshadow drop Snake-eyes off to get the White Clown, they come back to base and as they are climbing down out of the B-2, Stormshadow SENSES a PASSIVE Infra-red beam or laser or something.

Uh.........something "passive" means its NOT an emitter, its like a heat sensor------it picks up stuff, it doesn't emit anything. How can Stormshadow SENSE something that isn't affecting his body or surroundings in the first place?? There's quite a few other examples in the books.

Hama can weave a story, but not always a good story. GIJOE was full of characters spouting off the tech specs of their gear in the midst of a battle, and really......that's writing down to an audience.

Hama is quite overrated, imo, I hate to use the term hack..........but sadly, it applies.

 

 

For this movie to work, A) forget the silly humor of the cartoons, in fact pretend they never existed. The comics were the real GI Joe and Cobra! the movie has to be dark cos if you look at it this is a very dark story; a major terrorist threat to the world and it exists on American soil in it's own stepford town and there is nothing legal anyone can do about it cos the corporations protect them? This is a dark moment in American history.

 

This story shouldn't even be looked at untill there is a real director with real chops and is willing to make a serious film. This is a deep story here...and it will get all lost in hollywoody crap.

 

Deep?

Depth stops, or at least slows, once you get a bad guy parading around with a hood over his head, wanting to take over the world. There's no two ways about that, its a ludicrous agenda and situation.

Based on works that have come before, and the kind of storytelling mentality that Hollywood tends to muster, the best this movie can aspire to is a kind of fun sinister quality. Not comical, but not sombre either.

It would be a mistake, imo, to invoke 9/11 in this, to push that its an American team of soldiers--because majority of the planet has been force-fed those kinds of ideas--and quite honestly have had their fill.

Transformers is a good gauge here, because the American troops battling the robots were not overly-emphasized as being American. Transformers has been incredibly well-recieved because those elements were not pushed--they are there, but not emphasized. GIJOE can be managed the same way--perhaps a American-based UN-flavoured team. They can still be America's highly trained special mission force.

Making this a serious work will doom it, because the reality outside our windows is something everyone wants to AVOID visiting. Making this more of a broader fantasy, with some "realistic" overtones makes it more accessible.

Obviously, different people are going to ahve different visions about the property. The cartoon is the more prominent of the two major media the toy-line used, and the comic has some of the less-broader elements of the cartoon.

Thing is, when you talk about COBRA Commander, more people off the street are apt to recall Chris Latta's screaching performance than recall reading ANY isses of the comic itself. That kind of thing strongly imprints with an audience and the creators of this movie, and its bound to be a strong consideration.

 

That's just the way the show biz works....

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Let's face it, GI Joe has only had TWO truly successful lines - RAH and the 25th Anniversary (yes, I know 12" was popular but not really what I'm talking about, since it wasn't a character driven line).

I don't think you can declare the 25th line a success just yet. it may be getting alot of praise, but there is no indication it is selling better than any of the new sculpt lines, which you have seem to declared as unsuccesful.

 

A bit early to judge, I admit, but it's certainly had a much more successful start than any of the new sculpt lines. All I've heard and read about it is that it's selling out in a lot of places and retailers were not prepared for demand, based on previous GI Joe lines that were not generally well-received. So yeah, I'd say that's an indication it's doing better than the other new sculpt lines... Maybe not hard numbers, but certainly an indication.

 

 

Speaking of True Lies...

 

as good as that film is, they couldn't make one like that today. We all know why. So, in that sense, we may get a truly "evil" Cobra organization after all (instead of a clumsy one). I don't think Hasbro would want kids to think that being a terrorist is funny and/or fun.

 

Um, have you seen Team America? No one had a problem with terrorists being depicted as funny in that movie.

 

Besides, you missed the point - Cobra's obviously not going to be depicted as an Islamist terrorist group, so it's not going to be a problem anyway. It'll be fine if there's a little sci-fi type out there stuff, including comic-book style plots. Not that they should be seen as "clumsy", but a little silly and maybe even sympathetic in some cases (the audience should be able to sympathize with, say, Destro to a certain point, and certainly Storm Shadwo).

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Um, have you seen Team America? No one had a problem with terrorists being depicted as funny in that movie.

 

Ah, but that's something entirely different. That wasn't a film aimed at kids _at all_. We know G.I.Joe will be.

 

 

You and the others still make some good points though.

 

 

 

I guess we all just want a well-balanced film. With the right amounts of action, drama, humor and romance.

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Let's face it, GI Joe has only had TWO truly successful lines - RAH and the 25th Anniversary (yes, I know 12" was popular but not really what I'm talking about, since it wasn't a character driven line).

I don't think you can declare the 25th line a success just yet. it may be getting alot of praise, but there is no indication it is selling better than any of the new sculpt lines, which you have seem to declared as unsuccesful.

 

A bit early to judge, I admit, but it's certainly had a much more successful start than any of the new sculpt lines. All I've heard and read about it is that it's selling out in a lot of places and retailers were not prepared for demand, based on previous GI Joe lines that were not generally well-received. So yeah, I'd say that's an indication it's doing better than the other new sculpt lines... Maybe not hard numbers, but certainly an indication.

but that is just more speculation. I haven't read anything from any retailers that says that demand has been so overwhelming that they weren't prepared for it. that just seems like an interpretation of why people are having trouble finding them right out the gate, but that happens with any new wave of toys, including all the other new sculpt lines.

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yep no body is taking this story seriously.

 

this is sad.

 

 

I think some people took my thoughts on this topic earlier the wrong way.....don't get me wrong here. I'm not saying that I want GI Joe the movie to be on par with "The Godfather" or anything and have no humor in it and be completely "SERIOUS." What I meant was that I hope they take the source material seriously....when putting together the script and the movie. I know its based on a toy and a cartoon/comic book.....but I'm hoping that we somehow get their iconic look in some way.....not just a blonde white guy/red head/guy in green beret/black man/ in camoflage or black suits the whole movie. This movie IMO has the potential to crash hard IMO if not done right.....and this guys resume IMO doesn't say much.....for the most part movies are how what WE know and love are introduced to the masses thats why fans get the way they do when properties are "Hollywoodized" it hasn't really been happening lately cause Hollywood is still learing but you guys know what I mean.

 

I just want them to respect the source material.......and my "Street Fighter" movie reference earlier was to a property that had a lot of different "Villians" and "Heroes" and were all thrown together in one steaming pile of crap just to get every character on screen. I just have a bad feeling about a movie thats all......I don't see them doing it well.......especially with this director.

 

I'm kind of seeing two forms of "serious" here.

 

One is talking about a serious movie with a serious story. As opposed to a "cartoony" type of movie. I think a good example might be TMNT. The original stories by Eastman and Liard (sp?) were pretty "dark" as mentioned by someone above, in that they were more "adult" oriented. They were comic books, yes, but not really "kiddie" comics. But then the cartoon/movies turned them into "kiddie" characters.

 

The other "serious" I'm seeing is the thought that those involved in the project itself might not take things seriously. There could be the most perfect script for a movie, but if the director/cast/crew don't take things seriously (this is "just a kid's movie" kind of thing) well then that great script doesn't matter.

 

 

Deep?

Depth stops, or at least slows, once you get a bad guy parading around with a hood over his head, wanting to take over the world. There's no two ways about that, its a ludicrous agenda and situation.

Based on works that have come before, and the kind of storytelling mentality that Hollywood tends to muster, the best this movie can aspire to is a kind of fun sinister quality. Not comical, but not sombre either.

It would be a mistake, imo, to invoke 9/11 in this, to push that its an American team of soldiers--because majority of the planet has been force-fed those kinds of ideas--and quite honestly have had their fill.

Transformers is a good gauge here, because the American troops battling the robots were not overly-emphasized as being American. Transformers has been incredibly well-recieved because those elements were not pushed--they are there, but not emphasized. GIJOE can be managed the same way--perhaps a American-based UN-flavoured team. They can still be America's highly trained special mission force.

Making this a serious work will doom it, because the reality outside our windows is something everyone wants to AVOID visiting. Making this more of a broader fantasy, with some "realistic" overtones makes it more accessible.

Obviously, different people are going to ahve different visions about the property. The cartoon is the more prominent of the two major media the toy-line used, and the comic has some of the less-broader elements of the cartoon.

Thing is, when you talk about COBRA Commander, more people off the street are apt to recall Chris Latta's screaching performance than recall reading ANY isses of the comic itself. That kind of thing strongly imprints with an audience and the creators of this movie, and its bound to be a strong consideration.

 

That's just the way the show biz works....

 

Don't you think, given the "national fervor" they would portray the Joes "correctly"? Transformers could down play the military characters (hell, they coulda probably got rid if them entirely). But G.I. Joe IS military characters.

 

And I don't think Cobra's "terrorist" angle has anything to do with anything. The "Bad Guys" are ALWAYS trying to rule the world.

 

I think it merely boils down to the right mix of serious and fantasy. Too much of either will ruin it, but what exactly is the "right mix"? A couple of other things to consider:

 

1) This would probably be something of an "origin" story. Cobra does bad things and a special strike team is compiled to deal with them so we get to see the various Joe characters assembled. Something like that. Lots of the fantasy elements not necessary because things would lean more towards the "realistic" military aspects. Of course that kind of depends on the MacGuffin, which leads to 2.

 

2) The MacGuffin. In that is the fantasy elements. But it has to be realistic. I actually think the G.I. Joe cartoons did a good job with some of the MacGuffins. The creation of Serpentor, for example, allowed them to show case a large cast with all their specialties. They had to go the Alexander the Great's DNA underwater. So that meant guys like Wet-Suit, Deep Six and Shipwreck. Or that trip to Siberia show cased Frostbite and the Oktober Guard, etc.

 

But this movie would be extremely small. Probably not more than Snake Eyes and 5 or 6 other Joes, Cobra Commander, Baroness, Major Bludd, Storm Shadow and, maybe Firefly (Zartan would be in a sequel because of his special abilities). And of course Blueshirts. So the MacGuffin would necessarily be something "small" (ie. believable). Serpentor, while it worked for the toon would not work here. The Weather Dominator would probably work. The MASS Device...maybe.

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This is what worries me about anything good. If it sells really well off the start wallmart will try to flood the market with them like they always do, then it would be forever until we got to see the next wave, unless they keep selling well which is what we all are hoping for. Im sorry but ive seen some good lines come and go due to walmart needing to flood their shelves thinking anything could be runaway hits, when in actuality they just need their space to grow gradually. Just look at their strategy for spiderman 3 and those are flooded on the shelves taking up so much wall space ( at least here anyway)

 

I am hoping that they do get enough for the time that wave 2-3 come out as Firefly and the rest must be mine, they look so awesome. Also I am hoping this line is a runaway hit that speaks for itself, only time will tell.

 

 

Thats my 2 cents

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I don't think a G.I.Joe movie is going to get the kind of budget a Star Wars film would get, and only if it DID...would they be able to pull it off. James Cameron could possibly do some justice to the RAH story and it's characters, but I don't even think he'd know how to approach the images of Cobra, and how to bring them to life, on the big screen, without looking campy and cheesy?

 

Cobra will end up looking like convention attendees dressed up like their favorite Cobra characters, and that's just going to be too much to bare. ^_^

 

I say stick with a high budget cartoon.

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Don't you think, given the "national fervor" they would portray the Joes "correctly"?

 

But what is "correctly"?? The widest exposure GIJOE has seen in media is the cartoon.

Is that the version to base all this off of--Chris Latta and all??

I dunno.

 

The Joe team wasn't military in almost ANY sense in the cartoons--it was just a "team of people".

 

The comics had a more militaristic slant, but they were boring by and large--and quite self-indulgent.

 

But this movie would be extremely small. Probably not more than Snake Eyes and 5 or 6 other Joes, Cobra Commander, Baroness, Major Bludd, Storm Shadow and, maybe Firefly (Zartan would be in a sequel because of his special abilities). And of course Blueshirts. So the MacGuffin would necessarily be something "small" (ie. believable). Serpentor, while it worked for the toon would not work here. The Weather Dominator would probably work. The MASS Device...maybe.

 

Well, I disagree it would be small--simply because of the associations to the toy-line. Its fairly well known that GIJOE has a lot of character, at least to those that have been exposed to it. There's a lot of background faces--like in a X-men movie. So-and-so would have a cameo, maybe a bit speaking part, and maybe an expanded role in a second movie--but they would still be a small part of the film. Like Colossus in X-men--fanboys went nuts when he did a 5 second cameo in the second movie, and he had all of 30 seconds of combined screen time in the third. That's what one could expect.

We'd have our cool moment of the GIJOE team pinned down somewhere and Lowlight in a sniper perch making that one shot to clear the way for the team. That'd be Lowlight in the movie-15 to 30 seconds, a toy in the toyline and memories in our head.

I think that is what we can expect.

 

Outside of COBRA Commander, maybe one of the supporting villains, and the made hero ( Duke) and Snake-eyes and Scarlet ( and the romantically interested) the story would be about anyone else. All the rest of the bodies walking through the scenes serve as visual/plot filler.

And that KIND of movie has been done successfully enough before--and I think its what we'll get for GIJOE.

 

Making the same KIND of movie as something like Transformers is probably going to be the goal here, and if that is considered successful and a worthwhile take on that franchise by folks here than GIJOE would be well served to be handled in the same light.

 

And I maintain that if one abides by the cartoons, then the atrocious 80's movie MEGAFORCE is the closest we have seen to GIJOE. Certainly that is not a route I want to see it take.

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Apparently you have not really read the marvel comic.

 

 

Oh please, I own every issue of the Marvel run. Let's look at it as it is.

 

 

Oliver stone would actually be a good choice. But I'm more inclined to suggest a newer director who's familiar with DARK fantasy type EPICS: Timur Bekmambetov of Night Watch.

 

Yes I did say dark and GI Joe is a very dark story about how a government machine helped orchestrate the creation of Americas first major domestic terrorist organization. The story of cobra commander is sad and his son is messed up. the story of snake eyes is depressing, Storm shadow is a glimmer of hope, and Zartan represents man willing to redeem himself. Destro exposes how corrupt our government is and the Jugglers are just proof that corporations really run the world.

 

 

A dark story? With a guy cloaked in a hood, running around with gay-pride candidates ( including a guy in a BIRD outfit and a chap who sleeps with crocodiles!) using giant robotic walkers coming out of the sea, nanobots and all manner of sci-fi weapons?? I see a pretty whimsical story in all that........its pretty far-fetched to begin with--dark wouldn't serve any of that..........simply because NONE of that is dark.

 

 

Larry Hama wrote some of the most amazing drama in a world of futurism and sci fi technology, with character as colorful as they were dangerous.

 

Hama is lauded as this great writer............but again, let's look at things as they are. He's NOT a great writer--in fact, he's pretty sloppy a lot of time. Reading all those Marvel comics I have I can see a great deal of utter BS in military things that were supposed to be researched. Not art things, but dialogue and character bits that are horribly wrong or cliched.

Here's two examples: Some GIJOE team member hgead over to the UK and met up with some SAS guys--who are prim-proper "say wot, cheerio!" tan-beret wearing Brit cliches. Had Hama done some simple reasearch, reading Tony Geraghty's prominent book on the regiment, he'd have known that SAS operatives tend towards being scruffy types, permitted to have lax grooming standards because of the nature of their work. They'd also not be driving up to the lads in a jeep wearing wooley-pulleys and tan berets.

Hama flubbed that one.

A second: when Stalker and Stormshadow drop Snake-eyes off to get the White Clown, they come back to base and as they are climbing down out of the B-2, Stormshadow SENSES a PASSIVE Infra-red beam or laser or something.

Uh.........something "passive" means its NOT an emitter, its like a heat sensor------it picks up stuff, it doesn't emit anything. How can Stormshadow SENSE something that isn't affecting his body or surroundings in the first place?? There's quite a few other examples in the books.

Hama can weave a story, but not always a good story. GIJOE was full of characters spouting off the tech specs of their gear in the midst of a battle, and really......that's writing down to an audience.

Hama is quite overrated, imo, I hate to use the term hack..........but sadly, it applies.

 

 

For this movie to work, A) forget the silly humor of the cartoons, in fact pretend they never existed. The comics were the real GI Joe and Cobra! the movie has to be dark cos if you look at it this is a very dark story; a major terrorist threat to the world and it exists on American soil in it's own stepford town and there is nothing legal anyone can do about it cos the corporations protect them? This is a dark moment in American history.

 

This story shouldn't even be looked at untill there is a real director with real chops and is willing to make a serious film. This is a deep story here...and it will get all lost in hollywoody crap.

 

Deep?

Depth stops, or at least slows, once you get a bad guy parading around with a hood over his head, wanting to take over the world. There's no two ways about that, its a ludicrous agenda and situation.

Based on works that have come before, and the kind of storytelling mentality that Hollywood tends to muster, the best this movie can aspire to is a kind of fun sinister quality. Not comical, but not sombre either.

It would be a mistake, imo, to invoke 9/11 in this, to push that its an American team of soldiers--because majority of the planet has been force-fed those kinds of ideas--and quite honestly have had their fill.

Transformers is a good gauge here, because the American troops battling the robots were not overly-emphasized as being American. Transformers has been incredibly well-recieved because those elements were not pushed--they are there, but not emphasized. GIJOE can be managed the same way--perhaps a American-based UN-flavoured team. They can still be America's highly trained special mission force.

Making this a serious work will doom it, because the reality outside our windows is something everyone wants to AVOID visiting. Making this more of a broader fantasy, with some "realistic" overtones makes it more accessible.

Obviously, different people are going to ahve different visions about the property. The cartoon is the more prominent of the two major media the toy-line used, and the comic has some of the less-broader elements of the cartoon.

Thing is, when you talk about COBRA Commander, more people off the street are apt to recall Chris Latta's screaching performance than recall reading ANY isses of the comic itself. That kind of thing strongly imprints with an audience and the creators of this movie, and its bound to be a strong consideration.

 

That's just the way the show biz works....

 

Most of the elements I'm focusing on are not the far fetched costumes, the crazy robot walkers, serpentor, or any newly introduced elements from Devils Due.

 

Taking over the world is a constant with bad guys. The part I found most intriguing is how Hama took a normal Bad guy taking over the word story and gave him a history of anti-government rallys after his inability to hold down a used car lot. Gave him a son who ended up growing up in the middle of this. Then added a few interesting characters with a even more interesting backgrounds (man in the iron mask, military experiment on a human being) both of which became co-creaters of the organization. Then one learns the American government might have been involved in making this whole mess. Later on you get this whole redemption bit (Zartan) revenge (stormshadow) and the one caught in the middle (snake eyes)...this just makes for good story writing, however these elements can get lost in the glamor of hollywood focusing on the spider tanks and the hooded evil guy and the gay pride parade.

Recent Directors that have been given superhero scripts have been taking good care to ask in their minds "how can I make this look believable and realistic". These directors started from films that they enjoyed doing and were almost pet projects of sort and where into making serious film (yes, that includes evil dead). Look at what Christopher Nolan has done with Batman.

 

GI Joe needs that kind of treatment. So no I'm not looking for a GI Joe vs Cobra with bright blue Nazi uniforms and a doctor doom wannabe, I am hoping to see if someone takes the more dramatic effects of the story based on Larry's work for marvel and put that in the foreground and leave the special effects gadgets waaaaaay behind the scenes.

 

 

 

"Making this a serious work will doom it, because the reality outside our windows is something everyone wants to AVOID visiting. Making this more of a broader fantasy, with some "realistic" overtones makes it more accessible."

 

 

Making this serious work would put so much attention to the film. Most audiences would be amazed that there was some real intense ideas in something they once thought was for kids or for toys.

 

The political stuff about the Jugglers would really hit home because we are dealing with alot of it today. America is starting to see how more and more corporations are trying to run the government. That idea was a main focus in the comic written by Larry back in the 80's. Then there is the bit about how now in America we are more aware that we are using privately owned para-military mercenary organizations to fight our wars. In this case we have a questionable organization on American soil that is it's own military with it's own technology and if need be could totally turn against the American people.

 

I think an element in todays time like this could be some great material for how Cobra actually comes to be.

 

When you put writing like that on screen you get people not only entertained but also you start alot of interesting dialog as well.

 

Making the Joes a UN group is a good Idea. Put I think we should make Cobra start off as one of these private military organizations that turns against every one. It makes sense. And it hits close to home.

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Most of the elements I'm focusing on are not the far fetched costumes, the crazy robot walkers, serpentor, or any newly introduced elements from Devils Due.

 

Taking over the world is a constant with bad guys. The part I found most intriguing is how Hama took a normal Bad guy taking over the word story and gave him a history of anti-government rallys after his inability to hold down a used car lot. Gave him a son who ended up growing up in the middle of this. Then added a few interesting characters with a even more interesting backgrounds (man in the iron mask, military experiment on a human being) both of which became co-creaters of the organization. Then one learns the American government might have been involved in making this whole mess. Later on you get this whole redemption bit (Zartan) revenge (stormshadow) and the one caught in the middle (snake eyes)...this just makes for good story writing, however these elements can get lost in the glamor of hollywood focusing on the spider tanks and the hooded evil guy and the gay pride parade.

Recent Directors that have been given superhero scripts have been taking good care to ask in their minds "how can I make this look believable and realistic". These directors started from films that they enjoyed doing and were almost pet projects of sort and where into making serious film (yes, that includes evil dead). Look at what Christopher Nolan has done with Batman.

 

GI Joe needs that kind of treatment. So no I'm not looking for a GI Joe vs Cobra with bright blue Nazi uniforms and a doctor doom wannabe, I am hoping to see if someone takes the more dramatic effects of the story based on Larry's work for marvel and put that in the foreground and leave the special effects gadgets waaaaaay behind the scenes.

 

 

:( Then it wouldn't really be G.I.Joe to me.

 

It's just taking the familiar names from ARAH and trying to use them to make just another Delta Force.

 

 

Making this serious work would put so much attention to the film. Most audiences would be amazed that there was some real intense ideas in something they once thought was for kids or for toys.

 

 

I'm into the toys, that's why I'm a G.I.Joe fan. I'm not (just) into the characters from Larry Hama's writings for a comic book.

 

Making the Joes a UN group is a good Idea. Put I think we should make Cobra start off as one of these private military organizations that turns against every one. It makes sense. And it hits close to home.

 

Joes...UN????? @hmmm@

 

No way in HELL! Joes are suppose to be the GOOD guys! ^_^

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Making this serious work would put so much attention to the film. Most audiences would be amazed that there was some real intense ideas in something they once thought was for kids or for toys.

I just keep tripping up over making it a serious work.

It'd be like making a serious film out of Super Mario Brothers--both it and GIJOE stem from toys......

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The problem I see from my point of view is that in hollywood they cant do anything anymore that isnt over the top. Any normal story that was a good story made years ago, couldnt be made now due to it not being big/bad/bold enough with explosions every 2 seconds and everything has to be about the END of the world if the team doesnt fix it. GI Joe is supposed to be a behind the scenes military group that takes care of threats not the full scale military, otherwise our villains wouldnt be cobra, they would be other countries. They are a highly trained special mission force, and are more or less tried to be hush hush, not going out in the public having battles and tearring up cities roadways etc. I kind of interpretted that as a navy seal time going in doing special missions.

That is one of the reasons I hated the new transformers movie and micheal bay, they arrived on earth and are trying to blend in and defend earth, not go out and blow the crap out of everything and have war on earth while trying to defend against the possible end of the earth.

For it to be a blockbuster it would have to be a total war/ epic movie with the special effects, which could be a "part" of it, but not what its all about.

 

If its anything like transformers, I will not watch it period

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Another little thing that I'm sure will happen with this flick is the downplaying of good old fashioned PATRIOTISM.......you know why???? Cause studios want to cater to the worldwide audience......I can see that going down the toliet

 

 

Prime Example......Superman Returns- "Does he still stand for truth, justice, you know all that stuff?" The American Way was substituted for "All that stuff"......awful......I can't wait. I hate to be a doomsayer but I just don't know.

 

 

Oh and thanks you guys for keeping this discussion civil for the most part.......some great arguing going on here. @firedevil@

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I"m not feeling Ray Park as Snake-Eyes and he was Darth Maul like 8 years ago......I'm over him. Plus the guy playing Snake-eyes out of costume can be someone completely different as long as they have the same frame.

 

Ed Harris as Hawk.....Nuff Said.....

 

Chuck Norris as the original GI Joe.....Joe Colton.....bring it on baby.......Rob Lowe as Tomax and Xamot.......Kate Beckinsale as Scarlett.....and Jessica Biel as Lady Jaye.....who knows about Duke and the rest of them......I can't think......Wesley Snipes or Eamonn Walker as Stalker..... Walker was the black seal team member from "Tears of the Sun." Gerard Butler as Destro......Leonidas in "300" for those that don't know......Scottish and all.

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The political stuff about the Jugglers would really hit home because we are dealing with alot of it today. America is starting to see how more and more corporations are trying to run the government. That idea was a main focus in the comic written by Larry back in the 80's. Then there is the bit about how now in America we are more aware that we are using privately owned para-military mercenary organizations to fight our wars. In this case we have a questionable organization on American soil that is it's own military with it's own technology and if need be could totally turn against the American people.

 

 

Hey Skullfire,

Where is the proof? Or do you just make this up in your head? Actually your right,Walmart brought down the Twin Towers...Grow up!

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Mummy and Mummy 2 were far above anything Bay has ever done. Garbage like Pearl Harbor and Armageddon couldn't compare. And they had mass-shifting, subspace and magic, all of which are above Bay(hmm, Men in Black had mass-shifting, Evolution had it... no one complained then. But even TF used it regardless of what they say- Frenzy's cell phone mode, BB folds from giant robot to small car, Megatron's fusion cannon barrel comes from nowhere, nevermind the magic shrinking Allspark... sorry but TF did use mass-shifting and subspace to a heavy degree). Or beneath him if you hear him say it.

 

Van Helsing was doomed due to being a Castlevania knockoff though.

 

I wish Hollywood would drop this "realism" kick anyway. Ghostbusters and BTTF certainly didn't have to try and live up to such restrictions(which is why TF will NEVER be equal to GB in my eyes- it tried too hard to be epic but thinned the plot with action scenes). Think about it- Bay ruined Texas Chainsaw Massacre with his re-imagining. If it were announced Bay was doing a remake of GB, would it be anything but bad? One of Bay's movies is gonna be about 2 guys in Florida who attempt a kidnapping plot, he says it'll be a comedy. Hmm... so, he's ripping off Dave Barry's Big Trouble but skirting it by excluding the nuclear bomb. Does Bay even have his own ideas anymore?

 

yeah, I liked Transformers but it wasn't the greatest I've ever seen. I didn't hate it but didn't feel it was a cinematic masterpiece. Bay's childish "me me me" attitude also ruined my enthusiasm- expecially when he changed the designs to be what HE wanted(I don't recall Bay being a robotics engineer), constantly berated fans(the fans should be catered to on SOME level... ignorign the fanbase outright is stupid. They are the LOYAL CUSTOMERS after all, replacable as they may be in the corporate eye) and generally acted like a 4 year old about the film. Or maybe i'm jaded because of all his rants about not making a "toy movie" only for characters like Brawl and Bonecrusher to show up only to sell the related toys(I favored getting the $10 Bonecrusher over waiting for the $20 version... he lives for 2 minutes, never talks, then gets his head cut off. I'll buy the $40 Brawl mind you... generally better toy). The guy lacks the vision or people like Ivan Reitman.

 

Megatron was also another idiot... yes, I called movie Megs an idiot. Instead of crossign the roof to go grab the allspark, he threatens Sam for no reason(did he really think it'd be handed over?) then whips his claw around to show off CGI work and sends his prize hurtling to the ground. He's an idiot, moreso than G1 Megs ever was in his lamest moments.

 

Then again, I like the Super Mario movie. But there's a difference between "we can't stick close to the source" and "we don't want to stick close to the source", which hollywood usually does the latter. I'm still trying to figure out how Spider-Man's organic webshooters work... seems he'd have to subspace store a LOT of that webbing. Even if the glands ran up between his arm bones(ignoring the muscle displacement) to store that much webbing would weigh his arms down. Or his body would consume itself to generate the webbing(he runs out in SM2 but seems to have refilled in minutes). For all of Raimi's reasons to avoid the mechanical webshooters he didn't bother to really think things through there.

 

There was a time when "movie magic" emant something. Now directors are too afraid to go overboard and CGI companies more concerned with how many moving its they can render so they can pat themselves on the back for it. But not everyone is that way... Terry Gilliam decided to stick to the source on Fear and Loathing in LV. I dread to think of some other director doing that movie.

 

Campy yet serious can work. McHale's Navy struck me as being a lot like GI Joe- campy with its characters but serious with the murderous terrorist plot that never went too overboard either way. Hmm, wonder if Bruce Campbell would play Shipwreck? True, tone down the costumes, but Cobra Commander was pretty much a Nazi uniform with an odd mask. Okay, so I don't see a metal Destro mask totally working without a lot of adjustment(I dont't think much thought ever went into his design, really).

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Let's face it, GI Joe has only had TWO truly successful lines - RAH and the 25th Anniversary (yes, I know 12" was popular but not really what I'm talking about, since it wasn't a character driven line).

I don't think you can declare the 25th line a success just yet. it may be getting alot of praise, but there is no indication it is selling better than any of the new sculpt lines, which you have seem to declared as unsuccesful.

 

A bit early to judge, I admit, but it's certainly had a much more successful start than any of the new sculpt lines. All I've heard and read about it is that it's selling out in a lot of places and retailers were not prepared for demand, based on previous GI Joe lines that were not generally well-received. So yeah, I'd say that's an indication it's doing better than the other new sculpt lines... Maybe not hard numbers, but certainly an indication.

but that is just more speculation. I haven't read anything from any retailers that says that demand has been so overwhelming that they weren't prepared for it. that just seems like an interpretation of why people are having trouble finding them right out the gate, but that happens with any new wave of toys, including all the other new sculpt lines.

 

Well, not really, I've talked to two retailers in person and that was their experience. That, plus seeing some of the figures and sets sell out at online stores, fetch high prices on Ebay, and get mentioned on websites that aren't devoted to GI Joe (like Shortpacked, for instance), led me to the conclusion (for now) that they are a success. There certainly wasn't any sort of buzz around the older new sculpt lines, not like this anyway.

 

But yeah, of course time will tell. I'm not really sure why were arguing about it though, it doesn't really change my argument - none of the other incarnations ever came close to defining the look of the characters in RAH, so the movies should use them as a base. 100% the same wouldn't be necessary, but it's not like the (earlier) designs were unrealistic. I can see gear and weapons being updated but there's no reason Flint wouldn't wear a black beret, black combat shirt and camo pants, with his funky holster and shotgun shell holders on his webbing.

 

Another little thing that I'm sure will happen with this flick is the downplaying of good old fashioned PATRIOTISM.......you know why???? Cause studios want to cater to the worldwide audience......I can see that going down the toliet

 

 

Prime Example......Superman Returns- "Does he still stand for truth, justice, you know all that stuff?" The American Way was substituted for "All that stuff"......awful......I can't wait. I hate to be a doomsayer but I just don't know.

 

Some of you guys down south took that WAAYYY too seriously... I mean, it was obviously tongue-in-cheek. Speaking as a Canadian who grew up playing with RAH, GI Joe (and Superman as well) DOES have a worldwide audience, and the concept of fighting for freedom isn't universally American, obviously. As a kid I appreciated that they had Canadian stickers. As an adult, it would be an interesting backstory if GI Joe, in response to an international threat posed by Cobra, did in fact become an international force that worked with groups like the Oktober Guard and Big Ben and such... Kind of like Rainbow Six, except more comic-booky. It would also make them a bit more relevant in today's world, although I do think at some point the line "real American hero" should be used at some point! Can't forget where you came from, obviously.

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It's just a bad time to try and toss something PRO American onto the big screen right now, I'm surprised they're even considering it, although by the time this movie ever hits the screen we'll probably have another Clinton in office, and so Americans will be "cool" again? :rolleyes:

 

G.I.Joe.....

 

A REAL AMERICAN HERO??

 

 

That is the basis for it, and it is in the theme song, but now it seems as though that might not be prudent. Since nobody in America is actually FROM America, to be an AMERICAN is more to do with a sense of patriotism and pride. Tons of foreigners still flock to get in here (even illegally) but few these days will claim themselves as REAL AMERICANS. There are no "REAL" Americans, since like I said, we all came from some place else, following our ancestry, so again, it's a mental thing, a pride thing, a patriotic feeling in being proud to be here and proud to be part of something that is ultimately "good" and respected by others around the world, which you'd think is still TRUE, since the immigration numbers haven't exactly dropped off any? No, we've managed to let the media portray our politicians as corrupt and incompetent and more evil than the terrorist that brought down the Trade Towers, just so they can sway votes at election time. Problem is, it isn't JUST AMERICANS that are privy to this bullsh@#, and we've influenced what others about the globe tend to think of our people, based on what they see of us on the BOOB tube. @grumpy@

 

We've got American celebrities threatening to move to other countries if certain politicians get elected! :rolleyes: Talk about fueling the anti-American sentiments.

 

A G.I.Joe movie wouldn't stand a chance in hell trying to approach an American based team of terrorist fighting HERO'S, not these days! They'd have to leave out the obvious signs of it, like in the title ARAH and probably try to make them connected to the UN instead (as somebody already mentioned) so as they can come after Americans as well, and save the Earth, fighting the evil American Corporations, that pollute the air and cause all the global warming, and the big American oil companies that are financing an illegal war for oil, just to fatten their pockets along with the Saudis. Yeah, the best storylines for a new movie about a tag team of military experts going after the villains on the planet, would be non-american types, taking down American baddies.

 

Yeah, I'm all warm and fuzzy inside about the possibilities of how this crock of sh@# movie could go, once hollyweird gets their hands on it, and tries to figure out how NOT to offend everyone with the over use of that nasty AMERICAN word, and tone it down a bit. <_<

 

The movie ain't even on celluloid yet, and I'm hatin' it! #US1#

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Bay's childish "me me me" attitude also ruined my enthusiasm- expecially when he changed the designs to be what HE wanted(I don't recall Bay being a robotics engineer), constantly berated fans(the fans should be catered to on SOME level... ignorign the fanbase outright is stupid. They are the LOYAL CUSTOMERS after all, replacable as they may be in the corporate eye) and generally acted like a 4 year old about the film.

 

This is a point professional filmmakers roll their eyes at.

 

Fans get lip service, that's all, and the reason is quite clear.

Fan are loyal..............no............moreso, they are dedicated. They are a captive audience. Their dollars are assured because of the achilles heel of fandom: they will go see it even if its really a pile of crap--because no fan wants to miss out on something POTENTIALLY good. And fans are not always right in their opinions of a film.

The fan-base was inflamed by the casting of the first Batman movie ( this being pre-internet) and quite a few fans swore up and down the film would stink.

The general public didn't put any credence into the fans vitriol and went, and then so did the fans.

They couldn't NOT see it and have no ammo to rip it afterwards. Some actually ended up liking it.

That's how its gone with just abut every "fan"-aimed movie.

I don't think fans should be the main driving thrust in storytelling a film--one can salt the story with fannish bits, but I say don't write the piece solely for the fans. Write a film's story to entertain the widest possible audience. If the writers and director are fans of the proerty too, great, if not......they should just create the most appealing story they can with the material they have.

But having fans tell the creative team how to write the thing...........nope, I'd be telling the fans to go to heck myself--simply because the fans are consumers, not filmmakers or storytellers. Leave the job to those that know how to do it, I say.

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You know they are going to change it alot for REALISM, and to sell their new and improved visions to kiddies. The fact that transformers did well and the figures are selling tells people that they might NEED to change it so they can sell it and try to mimic the successful sales of transformers figures.

But if transformers was so great and thought out so well then why do they have to comeout with a transforming figure and a icon (more movie realistic) figure? besides for more money, but because they over did it. When the transformers transform, every little peice of them moves in some fashion, and my question is why??? because it had to be done? I dont think so!! And last time I checked the transformers I grew up with didnt roller blade down the highway because it would look cool or because it had to be done for a movie, but apparently the actual designer thought it would look cool, and he is very into car design soooo.

I think they need to get people that are interested in the project that were fans, and not just people that just see it as a paycheck/ way to express themselves through visions of something they see as needed to be changed when it doesn't. If the new line says anything it says if it aint broke don't f*&@ with it

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A G.I.Joe movie wouldn't stand a chance in hell trying to approach an American based team of terrorist fighting HERO'S, not these days! They'd have to leave out the obvious signs of it, like in the title ARAH and probably try to make them connected to the UN instead (as somebody already mentioned) so as they can come after Americans as well, and save the Earth, fighting the evil American Corporations, that pollute the air and cause all the global warming, and the big American oil companies that are financing an illegal war for oil, just to fatten their pockets along with the Saudis. Yeah, the best storylines for a new movie about a tag team of military experts going after the villains on the planet, would be non-american types, taking down American baddies.

 

Nah, cuz Tranformers featured American soldiers and hardware fighting the "bad guys" and the movie is doing quite well in spite of it.

Cheering on the heroes/underdogs is different from cheering on heroes wrapped in the flag. Play up the Joes as heroic, and being the underdogs in the battle against COBRA and the rapport with the audience will come to it.

Constantly barrage the audience with it being American-this, American-that and showcase characters heroically posed in front of dramatically flapping Old Glories and they'll choke on it. The film doesn't NEED that kind of imagery to get its essential point across.

These guys are American HEROES, not AMERICAN heroes-which, for all concerned, is probably the more comfortable/viable way to realize this.

GIJOE is more about the characters in play, not that they are AMERICAN characters. I know Duke is the first sergeant of an American unit, I can cheer for him and his heroic, boo and hiss at the bad guy he's facing. All he has to do is be heroic, noble, forthright, all the good qualities we like to see in a hero.

And yes, he's American too, because those qualities still fall in line with what an American soldier is expected to be.

 

They can draw other team members from all over the place, to give it a multi-national flavour that it sort of has already. Say that its a US-led team, with UN backing and US developed hardware.

Once its established it doesn't need to be re-emphasized.

Move on with the story from there and give us action and adventure--but the flag waving isn't necessary.

Just my take on it.

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