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HML Series 3


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Sales figures, projected sales, actual sales who give a flying f**k? Telemarketing and working at chain stores does not qualify you as anything other than another consumer so don't try to make yourselves sound all high and mighty. I've had more problems with hasbro than I did with toybiz, but from my view as a customer I could usually find toybiz legends, and I've had a much harder time finding hasbro legends in general. The Brood series looks to be a big improvement over the blob series, just as the blob series was a big improvement over the Annihilus series. I've been waiting for a Bucky and Black Knight figure for a long time. Marvel Girl and Cyclops look pretty cool too.

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The fact is, they are selling less and you know it. You don't need to throw out meaningless challenges that you know could never be met (showing you sales figures comparisons). I have seen HML2 in stores twice since they were released. And this isn't a case where I just always seem to "miss out." I'm saying almost every store in this city that carries MLs still has HML1 on the pegs and has never even ordered a case of series 2 and won't because they have too much of the series 1 junk left. Please explain to me how some of my stores had a dozen pegs for TB MLs and now only have 2 for HMLs and yet somehow you believe Hasbro is putting out MORE product than TB? If there is an abundance (which there isn't) , it is only because of poor sales...and the amount of shelf space they get is the best indicator of that.

For some perspective, I worked (and still work) at Walmart starting last summer. Last Christmas, we got a single case of the Onslaught wave in, it sold out in less than a week. Then we'd get two-three cases of Series 10 or 12 ((with the odd 11 in there), and they would lag. Hell, we NEVER got ANY of the last two waves from Toy Biz! During the post Christmas clearance, outside of one or two figures (usually the Hulk, Wolverine, or Spider-Man related characters), I could have built 3 Sentinals, 2 Apocalypse, and two half Onslaughts with what we had left AFTER Christmas.


When we set out the Hasbro Legends, we sold FOUR CASES in less than two weeks. I don't stretch the truth here at all. However, after a few more restocks, outside of Iron Man and Hulk, the figures would sit. By March, we had a pegs worth each dedicated to Banshee, White Queen, Beast, and Hercules. To date, we've gotten TWO cases of HML wave 2, that's it. We still have wave 1 sitting on the pegs (the whole 3 we have set to the line)


In regards to why so few pegs dedicated to HML now? Simple:

Movie toys

EVERY Walmart has nearly an aisle dedicated to Spider-Man 3, and nearly as much for Transformers. Some are still supporting Ghost Rider, and some also carry Fantastic Four 2 toys.

Plus Superhero Showdown

Plus Star Wars

You may not have noticed, but GI Joe or DC Heroes aren't getting a great deal of peg space either. More over, with Toy Biz, it was feast or famine, the reason for more pegs earlier I feel was largely because when stores finally got product, they got a LOT of it, and once they sold out, they had to wait sometime before replenishment came.


I said as much last year: I firmly believe that the core reason behind Toy Biz's "high sales" before were attributed largely to the situation of a store getting just one or two cases, collectors and scalpers buying out, sometimes entire cases, and stores left with nothing. But unlike Hasbro, Toy Biz didn't have a means to replenish these stores in a timely manner, thus creating a false "scarcity".

Now, a LOT of those speculators and even some collectors aren't buying as much because the supply is readily available.


You make soem good points.


Personally, I am very concerned by the emphasis on 6" Marvel movie figs from HASBRO, as these will definitely supplant additional LEGENDS waves.


And if they don't supplant actual LEGENDS waves, they'll definitely prevent us from ever getting more BOX SETS, FACE-OFFS, etc.


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Well for me personally, I would have to stand up and applaud Hasbro. I mean think about it before you attack me. They launched Hasbro ML1, then geared up for a HUGE toy boom across the US courtesy of the Spiderman 3 toys, sneak in Hasbro ML2 wave, then bounce right back up with AMAZING PRODUCTION for the Transformer movie toys, now throw in the NEW concept McQuarrie product Star Wars products for the anniversary celebration of Star Wars, and then find time to still get us Hasbro ML3 not much after the original due date. And now you adding the most successful wrestling line to date? I mean all the toy companies want Hasbro to due their distribution. I mean c'mon, really even you haters have to appreciate how spectatcular the Hasbro distribution machine REALLY is. Also a client of mine happens to be the head purchaser for Mattel Toys in San Bernadino and even he wishes Mattel was as good as Hasbro at execution of product placement. Lastly, just thought I would throw out that if you really, really think ML under Toybiz sold so well just go to your local KB Toys where ML 14 & ML 15 are cloggin their shelves and are on blow out for the past 4 months at buy 1 for $4.88 get a second figure for $2.44! Yea those last 2 lines of ML from Toybiz went over real well. Outstanding job HASBRO!


I guess when Hasbro has that full monopoly we'll really be up $h!t creek...

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Would it not be worth waiting to get that extra coat of paint everyone keeps criping about. Plus 4 wave a year are fine by me. With the price jump my wallet getting thin. Last year they had so much stuff coming out at one it got a litte to much for my wallet. I don't know how many my kids went without food so i could keep up with everything coming out. @loll@ {joke}It worth the wait to me if we get a better prouduct.Also where i live wave two been hard as hell to find. I found 14 of my 16 varients at my local wal-mart when toybiz had ML.With hasbro i can't find any.Do i think hasbro dropped the ball? Maybe ,maybe not . Do they got some kinks to work out yes.Do they got BIG SHOES TO FILL? yes.They took over one of the best toy lines ever. IT might take a while to work out all the bugs. Isn't time worth a better prouduct? @poke2@

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You live in Canada...please don't speak on things you have no knowledge of (i.e. how much TB product was in U.S. stores during their reign).


Hey, the info I'm speaking on comes from sites like this and posters like yourself.

All I'm doing is reminding people to check their "facts".


The fact is, they are selling less and you know it. You don't need to throw out meaningless challenges that you know could never be met (showing you sales figures comparisons).

No. I don't know it, and neither do you.

When someone utters the challenge that another voice is "wrong"--it becomes put up or shut-up time right back at them. Without the supportable data, none of us can make any claims with any certainty. My claims are as shaky too--really.......the ONLY support I have for them at this time is the collective comments of the toy forums I read, taken from all across North America and elsewhere. I'm not going into few toy store in ONE city and seeing things there and making assumptions. I'm gather my "data" from hundreds of collectors in dozens of cities all over, and then making my assumptions.


I read of more people finding these figures on the pegs, than I read of people NOT finding them--and that is common in the half dozen toy forums I browse through.



Also, this is the first I have ever heard of the last 2 waves of TBML only being available in the US.


You were not paying attention last fall.

Grand Toys ( Up here in Canada) and the Toybiz distributors overseas announced that due to the shortened sell-though times for ML14+15 before the Hasbro take-over of the license, the orders to Canada and Europe were cancelled. If retailers there wanted to get ML14 or 15 they had to go through US distributors like Diamond-which is what the few specialty retailers up here did.

Collectors like myself had to scramble to get the sets they wanted.

My local toy guy got in ML15, from the States, but did so in this past February. He was lucky because some stores never got their orders at all, and that was ordering via sources like Diamond.

Re-orders were impossible to get.


So, yea, I live in Canada, but I'm paying attention to what's going on. Let's not discount someone because of location, okay? You are physically in the thick of things in the States, but you were not aware of some of the things I just wrote about.



The key things here is that my voice is NOT saying Hasbro sucks, not saying the Hasbro line is doomed, not saying that Hasbro is botching the Marvel legends line, because quite frankly, they are not. That's simply a POV looking at things AS THEY ARE. Not better or worse that they are.


If sales were in the toilet, there'd be nothing shown at SDCC. There'd be no planned upcoming waves, we'd be getting nothing.

Truth be told, the line is continuing. That says its selling........in the most pragmatic of lights, its continuing because what's come up until now has sold enough to merit more like it. That's an obvious fact that takes no brains to figure out.


Now, I'm not a Hasbro supporter, I'm a Hasbro consumer. As long as they make stuff I like, I'll buy. They make a LOT of stuff I do not buy--so I guess the supporter label goes out the window.

I don't touch 90% of their lines.


We will know with a reasonable measure of confidence in a couple of days, how HEALTHY Marvel Legends really is with the showings at SDCC.

I say that if there's all new items showcased there for the fall and winter releases, then all this jibber-jabber about the line being doomed is knee-jerk bunk.

I said for months before this that SDCC would really be the landmark for this line, because the last vestiges of the Toybiz management of the brand would need the time to SDCC to be worked out.

I'd say its a SAFE bet that what we see at SDCC will be all Hasbro's management of the brand, so the critical evaluations of the line can really begin THEN.


But at no time am I going around saying that any other poster is "wrong", or that they are speaking on things they know nothing about. There's lots of info swirling around and it takes some time to grab and digest it. Not everyone has done that--so there's bound to be some knee-jerk reactions.


I maintain that any critics keep the WHOLE picture in mind, because a balance critique carries a ton more weight than one from someone basing off observation in a very confined locale.

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If you do a side-by-side comparison of the licenses for STAR WARS, G.I. JOE, TRANSFORMERS, and MARVEL LEGENDS, it's a safe bet that LEGENDS is the least lucrative of the four described


Well, GIJOE is really the least lucrative. Sure Hasbro owns it outright, but it sells sluggishly at that.

The Marvel brand as a whole is a HUGE potential profit-maker because things superheroic are very much in vogue right now.

GIJOE is getting a very timid push in comparison, all they have are the handful of figures (no vehicles) for the 25th Anniversary line, and the 5 12" repro Adventure Team figures as a Walmart exclusive--I'd hardly call any of those lucrative.

Transformers will be enormous come Christmas this year, and Star Wars is a perennial--always sells well now.


Next comes MARVEL. Remember, despite our love for the characters, only a select few are iconic, and have wide appeal across market segments - Spidey, Hulk, Wolverine & X-Men. Most people have no idea who the rest of Marvel's characters are, including ones that we as fans think are huge - like Captain America, Thor, Ironman, etc.


Have you forgotten that ALL these characters have been marketed since the 1960's?

The audience demographic for them is quite diverse, because its a good mix of kids, young adults and adults--all having been exposed to the comics, toys and TV shows/movies since then.

Shows like the Incredible Hulk with Bill Bixby were well rated for their day, and well known.

Characters like Captain America and Iron Man just haven;t gotten the cinematic lime-light, but they are prominent in print.

Comics sold easily 10 times more per issue back in the 70's and 80's than any of them do now--so all those eyes back then were exposed to those characters.

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Characters like Captain America and Iron Man just haven;t gotten the cinematic lime-light, but they are prominent in print.

Comics sold easily 10 times more per issue back in the 70's and 80's than any of them do now--so all those eyes back then were exposed to those characters.

Even then, I remember when Cap died a few months ago in the comics, it was all over the news.

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