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Translating HASBRO...


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OK...

 

Here's my translation of HASBRO's response to the Q&A:

 

QUESTION: Has there been any consideration to change the movie figures back from 5" to 6" scale?

 

Hasbro: We are always looking at our toy offerings and scale is something we look at very carefully. Stay Tuned!

 

Translation: No

 

Question: In terms of paint and articulation, is there any chance for more paint applications or the return of some of the traditional ML articulation?

 

HASBRO: Both paint and articulation are handled on case by case basis...taking into consideration the aesthetic of each character. Maximum articulation sometimes detracts from the overall appearance and quality of the figure. We know that many collectors and fans agree that the overall apearance of a figure ranks higher than the articulation point count.

 

Translation: No

 

Question: Any chance of a Fan's choice poll? Hasbro seems to handle them well on the Star Wars brand, one would be fun for Marvel Legends.

 

HASBRO: Absolutely! We are looking at various possibilities for 2008 and 2009!

 

 

Translation: '08 and '09 are a long way off. Hopefully, you'll forget about this by then.

 

Question: Would you consider a supplemental line that would re-release older, harder to find Marvel Legends figures from Toy Biz's run?

 

HASBRO: While we can't talk specifically about future waves, yet, we can say this --- There is a strong possibility that several old favorites could be revived. Stay tuned in 2008!

 

Translation: We love this idea! At minimal cost, we can make old figures from old molds, and re-release them as part of a Legends BAF Wave! That way, EVERYONE has to buy it...even the folks who were lucky enough to find the figure in the original wave! It's what we call "leverage".

 

Question: Will flying characters in the future come with holes in the back for flight stands and will flight stands be made available to purchase off Hasbro.com?

 

We are always looking to improve our toy offerings. Stay Tuned!

 

Translation: Shut-up.

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It is a load of BS when Hasbro takes us back to the 90's with the 5" Action Figures and charge us more than the ToyBiz Marvel Legends with no extras like comic reprints, minimal paint and non-existent washes, mediocre sculpts, less articulation, inconsistent availability and BAFs that are smaller in comparison to their predecessors. Hasbro needs to take some pointers from ToyBiz!

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It is a load of BS when Hasbro takes us back to the 90's with the 5" Action Figures and charge us more than the ToyBiz Marvel Legends with no extras like comic reprints, minimal paint and non-existent washes, mediocre sculpts, less articulation, inconsistent availability and BAFs that are smaller in comparison to their predecessors. Hasbro needs to take some pointers from ToyBiz!

 

Agreed. I often feel like I'm in a time warp with Hasbro's figures.

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You realize you're basing a company that had the line for 6+ years against a company that has had it for... almost 6 months. Better packaging (read I don't need to be a safe cracker and/or a stick of dynamite to get in), but $1 more expensive (sometimes inflation does happen. Notice the TAC figures are more expensive than the Saga Star Wars from last year?). And anyone pondered that a) myself (and many others I read) just tossed the comics aside as trash anyways or B) they have the rights to make the characters, but possibly not in the contract to start pushing out comic reprints?

 

I'm really not trying to fly the Hasbro flag at my camp as I had issues of my own with Series 1, but series 2 (at least on the computer) looks better. And don't forget Series VI, VII, VIII were notorious for being hard to find. Oh. And anyone anyone remember Toad? Talk about being brought back to the 90's (yes, he was a figure carried over from a different line and not exactly 'Marvel Legends' material).

 

It is getting a little frustrating, though, always coming to this board and everyone bashing the new product and waiting for Marvel Legends to be taken back by Toy Biz which seems akin to waiting on the second coming of Christ. They were awesome toys. Yeah. I own a ton of them, but someone new has them and instead of hoping the line tanks I hope they improve and flourish. Plenty of other characters I still need on my shelf.

 

Nostalgia won't get you new toys.

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You realize you're basing a company that had the line for 6+ years against a company that has had it for... almost 6 months. Better packaging (read I don't need to be a safe cracker and/or a stick of dynamite to get in), but $1 more expensive (sometimes inflation does happen. Notice the TAC figures are more expensive than the Saga Star Wars from last year?). And anyone pondered that a) myself (and many others I read) just tossed the comics aside as trash anyways or B) they have the rights to make the characters, but possibly not in the contract to start pushing out comic reprints?

 

I'm really not trying to fly the Hasbro flag at my camp as I had issues of my own with Series 1, but series 2 (at least on the computer) looks better. And don't forget Series VI, VII, VIII were notorious for being hard to find. Oh. And anyone anyone remember Toad? Talk about being brought back to the 90's (yes, he was a figure carried over from a different line and not exactly 'Marvel Legends' material).

 

It is getting a little frustrating, though, always coming to this board and everyone bashing the new product and waiting for Marvel Legends to be taken back by Toy Biz which seems akin to waiting on the second coming of Christ. They were awesome toys. Yeah. I own a ton of them, but someone new has them and instead of hoping the line tanks I hope they improve and flourish. Plenty of other characters I still need on my shelf.

 

Nostalgia won't get you new toys.

 

 

 

 

i have to agree with you and hope they do get better. there are a lot of charachters that have to be made. i have all of series 2 and they look a lot better than series 1 in my opinion.

 

the toad was suppose to be in the x-men classics line back then but was taken out and added to the legends line.

 

now there is something though i have to disagree on and that is the whole inflation thing. all that really is is the fact that hasbro wants to make more money on a popular line just like star wars. it still costs the same to make the figures. i really do not care for the package because they are easily damaged now during shipping and the boxes hasbro puts them in are too small for them. they might not have had the license to reprint the comics but don't go and raise the price up $2.00 more a figure. that is ridiculous and not just inflation.

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Ok, it seems when Marvel Legends first debut in 2002, they were considered revolutionary with new features such as improved poseability thru articulation, realistic paint applications and with facial features that captured the characters' essence. This evolved after ToyBiz handled the Marvel license in the early nineties. Fast forward to 2007, Hasbro decides it's time to go back to 5 inch lines, cheapen the Legends line by using less paint, by molding the plastic in the color with less or no paint washes at all. The result - cold expressionless figures that resemble less of the subject with limited posing and playability. This is not a good thing.

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The result - cold expressionless figures that resemble less of the subject with limited posing and playability. This is not a good thing.

 

No, it is definitely not a good thing.

 

I was adamant about takingf a "wait-n-see" approach to HASBRO.

 

I waited.

 

I saw.

 

Some of the changes are good - better plastic, sturdier joints, better distribution (at least with Wave 1)

 

Some of the changes are not good - "expressionless" plastic colors, poor paint apps, and sculpts that are hit-or-miss, and bizarre distribution on Wave 2...

 

Is there anyone on this board who, if the had the power to do so, WOULD NOT give the license back to MARVEL TOYS (Toy-Biz)??

 

...Yeah...that's what I thought...

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We can wait forever for Hasbro to improve things, but it will never happen. Hasbro has one interest and one interest only - profit. So long as this is their one overiding all-important value, which it always will be, their products will be dominated by how they can make as much money as possible. Hasbro does not care whether they make and sell Marvel Legends or nuclear weapons, they are simply interested in selling whatever will turn the biggest profit possible for their owners. This is the problem with money-based values; everything is a commodity, nothing has meaning beyond profit, nothing else matters. This profit drive is why Hasbro's ML's have minimal paint jobs and little or no washes. It's why their movie figures are 5" instead of 6". For greedy Hasbro, every penny counts. By not applying paint to a figure's skin, they'll save a half cent or so per figure, which adds up to a few bucks, which means greater profit margins. Capitalism demands that corporations make more money, grow and increase profit margins every year. This means we can expect ML's to be sacrificed further, cutting more corners, raising the price, all in the interest of profit. Hasbro has no love or care for ML's like we do, they see it only as a means of making money, and it shows.

 

ToyBiz was also interested in the profit margin, and they took plenty of cheap measures to make it happen and some of their toys suffered because of it. But the difference is that with ToyBiz, you could tell they loved the line, they loved ML's, and they tried their best to stretch their small budget to include and pack in as much fun with every toy they could. Their paint jobs made the figures feel like little pieces of art, instead of just plastic mass-produced molds. ToyBiz's products screamed fun, and you could see how they were always pushing the limits, trying to max out their ideas, give you as much as they could get away with. Hasbro has the opposite plan, they want to give as little as they can get away with, with little or no regard for the line itself.

 

I don't think we'll ever see ML's back in ToyBiz's hands. And it doesn't matter, that era is over. Hasbro's products can be good (I love the Blob BAF and the Ultimate 12" Ghostrider), but make no mistake - they don''t care about us or Marvel Legends, they only care about profit. This is why their toys feel unsatisfying and cold. This is why their Q&A is short and meaningless. I think we need some other company to make Marvel Legends. Hasbro will never give it the love it deserves.

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Okay, calm the f down - of course Hasbro is out to make a profit, all businesses are, even toybiz. These aren;t charity organizations. You saw a lot more stuff with toybiz because they were trying to find what best options they could include with their figures to drive sales and gain more money. They eventually found this gem of a marketing device called the Build a Figure - Hasbro hasn;t needed to do anything more because the BAFs almost guarantee larger sales from collectors buying entire waves instead of just one or two figures they like. It is actually a brilliant business stratagy - and Toybiz came up with it, not Hasbro. So listen, I do think toybiz was doing a better job, but Hasbro isn;t doing a bad job - they are just starting out. No need to villify them for doing exactly what ANY company and ANY toy producer would do: make money. (they've gotta eat too, ya know...)

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Okay, calm the f down - of course Hasbro is out to make a profit, all businesses are, even toybiz. These aren;t charity organizations. You saw a lot more stuff with toybiz because they were trying to find what best options they could include with their figures to drive sales and gain more money. They eventually found this gem of a marketing device called the Build a Figure - Hasbro hasn;t needed to do anything more because the BAFs almost guarantee larger sales from collectors buying entire waves instead of just one or two figures they like. It is actually a brilliant business stratagy - and Toybiz came up with it, not Hasbro. So listen, I do think toybiz was doing a better job, but Hasbro isn;t doing a bad job - they are just starting out. No need to villify them for doing exactly what ANY company and ANY toy producer would do: make money. (they've gotta eat too, ya know...)

 

 

 

 

i understand them making money but don't cut corners. it's just not right. hasbro has done this with there other toy lines as well and that's cut corners and raise prices. if they do not make a better product then people just won't buy them. i have nothing against hasbro making the marvel figures but they have to make there product a lot better for the price they are charging. there is always that old saying "you get what you pay for" . right now we are paying way too much for something that is not worth the money.

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My philosophy is, if the product stinks then don't buy it, in this case HML would qualify as a sub-standard Marvel line that's produced poor results in terms of bad quality and "spotty" distribution. What does this translate to, it translates to, I HAVEN'T SPENT ONE DAMN DIME OF MY MONEY ON THESE POS! If they don't get my money or your money that translates into poor sales, poor sales translates into product changes witch sometimes but not all the time improves a products chances of survival and if it doesn't it generally translates into cancellation. "Take it or leave it", that's the choices that we as collectors have, if you want something to change or to make it go away then don't buy it.

 

The Monger.

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See, I have this curse.

 

It's called a memory.

 

I remember the infamous gap between ML 5 and ML 6.

I also remember the deafening cries when ML6-8's lousy distribution caused so many not to be able to find the figures they wanted.

 

I remember multiple threads on multiple board droning on and on about how much Toy Biz sucks. How they didn't give a crap about "the fans". How they're character selection was God-awful.

 

I remember the complaining that ML 14 and 15 were just "phoned in".

 

I remember the seemingly endless gripes about Toy Biz's seeming consistently ugly females. And that they had females at all, and that the articulation was never right.

 

I remember the pure hate everyone had for the TB Daredevil base body's giant shoulder balls. And it's odd neck. And usual lack of foot swivel.

 

I remember threads dedicated to ways to get TB figures joints to move without breaking them due to "wash-lock".

 

And I also remember the complaining when Toy Biz moved AWAY from the 5" scale to 6" Legends.

 

Coincidentally, I remember characters like Emma Frost, and Banshee scoring near the top of many lists of characters "the fans" wanted to see done. And yet they warm the pegs.

 

My point is not a defense of Hasbro. Their odd execution of Emma's head and Banshee's chest are big reasons those figures can't be given away. And Wave two has yet to show up n my area period. Heck the Silver Surfer figures are barely at local Targets.

 

But increased price? Partly licensing fee's, but also the increased price of oil is to blame. The oil used to do everything from make the plastic to ship it across the ocean and across the country.

 

Shrinking BAF's? That too started with Toy Biz. See the increased cost of oil.

 

No, Hasbro is a far from perfect company, with an admittedly shaky track record. But life with Toy Biz was not the bed of roses many try to paint it as. Toy Biz was derided, defamed, and despised at various points in their long run. Toy Biz had the perfect set up and legitimately lost the license. And if for nothing else than the piss-poor quality control they consistently showed they deserved to.

 

Would I change back? Hard to say. I was fairly neutral on ML wave one, as for me the positives (not needing a blade to open the package, not frozen joints, vac metal parts, finally getting Hercules) balanced out the negatives ("why is he pink?", "what happened to her head?", "what's with the slappy hands?", "what happened to Sean's chest?"). Wave 2 I've only seen online. The switch to 5 inch for movie lines doesn't offend me nearly as much as Toy Biz's attempt to bury the market in nearly identical Spidey's for SM2. And I actually found a Sue for FF2, which is better than I could ever say for the last time. (and consequently why I have no TB FF movie figures, as I didn't want a Fantastic 3)

 

So all in all, I'm still willing to give Hasbro more time before I declare things as definitely worse. Mostly because I remember all the stuff Toy Biz did that ticked me off when it was their turn.

 

Thus is my curse.

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the price of oil is not the reason for the price increase. this is just hasbro being greedy with the marvel license. the cost of making a figure is still the same as when toybiz made the legends and you did not see them raise the price. not to mention we got a lot more for the price. and yes hasbro does need time to make the legends line better.

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TheMightyMiryClay might be on to something due to changes with licensing and price increase. The same reason Star Wars toys are much more expensive than GI Joes (and Transformers for that matter). Hasbro doesn't own the rights, they pay for them. Funny thing is I don't see countless threads on the Star Wars forum about the over priced VOTC which are the same price point as the Marvel Legends. And BAFS shrinking? MODOK and Mojo were the final two BAFs of Toy Biz.

 

Aside from MightyMiry does anyone else remember the countless posts of people wanting to Crucify the ToyBiz reps for shotty paint jobs, joints that either stuck (and sometimes broke due to trying to pry them open) or joints that were too loose to stay, and the odd distribution of MANY waves... I personally never saw the Wal-Mart wave in my area (and I have almost a dozen Wal-Marts around me in a 45-50 mile radius) AND these weren't just costume variants, but big name characters that made their first appearance? Oh.. and don't forget needing a variant to complete the gigantic BAF.

 

I just want people to remember the good with the bad. And talk about giving Hasbro a chance and you already have? Wow. A whole 6 months and 2 waves? Gee... thats patience.

 

On the plus side. Maybe the threads can lead up to new questions for the next Q&A. Ask why the price increase or why Wave 1 saturated and Wave 2 is sparse, or why no comic.

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the cost of making a figure is still the same as when toybiz made the legends and you did not see them raise the price. not to mention we got a lot more for the price.

 

No. they didn't. They did drop the cannon fodder from the Bring On The Bad Guys wave, cancled announced figures (Quicksilver from 15, Crimson Dynamo from 13), shrank BAF's, they re-thought BAF's (no Quinjet in 15), changed figure plans (Prof. X's smaller, cheaper chair), got stingy on accessories (Bullseye) and before that, they dropped the bulk bases for generally smaller BAF pieces. And the general quality of the plastic declined slowly but surely of the course of the lines. They dropped everything they could to try and stay consistent with themselves and keep the cost down. If that weren't evidence enough, Falcon stated all over the net that oil prices and production costs were on the increase and they were scrambling to try and keep from having to raise their price point.

 

Add to that a lisencing fee, and there's your price increase. However, if you want to believe it's just Hasbro trying to screw you personally, feel free.

 

and yes hasbro does need time to make the legends line better.

 

The 64 thousand dollar question is will they give it time. Hasbro is famous for giving up on comics related collector lines. (Pick a DC collector line from ANY of their many long years with the property) And I'm sure their poor wave one sales and general negative fan reaction has them scratching their heads. Unless wave two and 3 do very, very well, I can easily see them canceling the whole thing and focusing on the more kid aimed toys that are doing better. They've already canceled their ill-concieved signature series (the gift none of us asked for or apparently wanted). There's no reason to believe that they won't decided it's too much work to try and keep "the fans" happy and move on. They've done it before, they are more likely than not to do it again.

 

 

And I can't help but think something has gone very wrong for Hasbro distrobution wise of late. I can't conceive of them purposly not getting movie toys to market in time for a movie, yet thus far only Target has any FF2 toys, and then only one case per store. I can't take my locale as too typical as we sit in the middle of an area famously bad for getting things late. (usually 2-3 months after the first west coast sitings) But a quick scan of various toy boards tells me that the problem isn't just here. And this does concern me, as better distorubtion was a major sticking point for the switch being made to Hasbro.

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What would really be nice is if Hasbro wanted to continually make a profit on Marvel Legends and treat them like they treat GI Joe and Star Wars. The articualtion is not bad to me. I love how they did the new Thor. He actually looks like a God pf power, but the way Hasbro is now doing the hip joints is a pain. If you notice the GI Joe figures, they are free flowing. Especially the Sigma Six characters. There is no need to twist the ball joint itslef to position the figures just right. However, for the Marvel LEgends, I darn near have to break a leg to get a proper pose. And truthfully, this si a carry over from some of the last few waves of TB sculpts that Hasbro decided to re-use (see Yellowjacket, Quicksilver, and War Hulk as example) and for the sake of cost, decided not to change a darn thing. If they want my extra two dollars per figure, fix the hips, give me better BAFs to round up, or at least make it worth buying 8 figures by putting the Wolverines and Iron-Men figures on hold and gvie us some Inhumans or something worth while.

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Hasbro it's about making money...not pleasing the collectors... I am tired of them making too many fig's of the same character nobody wants. They should of dropped the Xmen III movie figs from the beggining... the new hml suck really bad...I still don't know what some of you guys see in them... HML1 didnt' sell good but only 2 figs, iron man & hulk..the rest pegwarmed for the longest...

Maybe it's just me...but they still haven't convinced me on anything...I have started collecting DCSH for the same price as HML, but I gets more.. a comic for one... they might not have as many characters as Marvel, but their figs don't suck.

 

That's my 2 cents :P

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the price of oil is not the reason for the price increase. this is just hasbro being greedy with the marvel license.

 

You've got to be joking. Oil is causing the price on almost everything to go up, gasoline not included.

 

 

 

 

the cost of oil maybe high here in north america but it is cheaper in other countries. then again you might not have known that. so it still costs the same as it did with toybiz. so once again it boils down to one thing , and that is GREED!!!

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