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Thanks for the report.

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And despite that info, people will STILL be complaining about Hasbro's laziness and how they are screwing the fandom with reused parts.

 

 

Yeah, I don't get that at all. You wouldn't see the same complaints with say, a 25th Flash figure that's head-swapped and repainted into a silver pads Grand-Slam.

 

I mean if the same two vintage Joes are wearing say. . .the same BDU-style pants, or a featureless T-shirt with bare upper-arms, then I won't pitch a fit if the same exact parts show up on two of their 25th ann. counterparts.

 

Just don't repaint the heads is all I'm asking.

 

-PJ

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And despite that info, people will STILL be complaining about Hasbro's laziness and how they are screwing the fandom with reused parts.

 

 

true

 

my only thing is the lethargic releases and familar look to alot of the figures

 

;-)

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Just a quick queston for Justin. . .

 

Are the 25th ann. figures a resurrection of the 3 3/4" line, or should the anniversary collection be considered its own 4" line? I'm hearing conflicting reports about exactly how tall they are.

 

-PJ

 

A little bit of both and a little bit of neither... how's that for a direct answer? ;)

 

Originally they were conceived of as their own line...their own individual tribute to the classic stuff. However, that doesn't necessarily mean they're of a different scale. In fact, the difference in height between the 25th stuff and the normal stuff is negligable at best, and the height of the figures is meant to be an accurate tribute of the scale we all know and love.

 

As it stands now, though, based on the retailer support and collector response, chances are pretty good, I'd suspect, that a "real" 3 3/4" line could potentially spawn out of this. That's total hyperbole on my part, nothing based on any "inside word" or anything, but everything I've seen and heard about this line has been 90-95% positive (in collector and retail corners outside of us hardcore Joe fans), and that's a very, VERY good thing for folks who are big fans of the 3 3/4" scale.

 

Justin

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And despite that info, people will STILL be complaining about Hasbro's laziness and how they are screwing the fandom with reused parts.

 

 

How is one (or two) persons opinion justifying the practice of repaints in a special anniversary set, considered an excuse that should be accepted and not commented on ANY further?

 

Here's the rationale given...

 

What's with all the repaints already?

 

- Repaints are a necessary aspect of toy manufacturing today to offset tooling costs. That being said, no toyline will thrive in the market if all it relies on are repaints and re-releases of existing tools. Yes, the first wave has alot of repainted characters or re-used tooling, mostly due to the impending schedule of release dates. However, you can rest assured that there will be a dramatic increase in new tooling used starting with the next wave of Single packs. Hasbro realizes that this first wave did take advantage of a lot of existing tooling, but you can be assured that new tools are a certainty in the near future for the anniversary line.

 

That's all fine and dandy...

 

IF..

 

the line does indeed go beyond 25.

 

Nothing has been confirmed on this, and that leaves us only the announced 25 figures of this special anniversary set. I would LOVE for there to be more, but I'm not going to set myself up for more disappointment and instead just take what I kNOW and hope for the best.

 

With that attitude, I can only judge these as I see them, and seeing a great character like Flint, get shortchanged on us, with a reuse of the Duke mold, is STILL disappointing to us Flint fans, who were expecting more. Equal attention to details of uniqueness that the other characters received shouldn't be too much to expect on a 25 set special anniversary edition. More to come or NOT, it stinks.

 

They won't redo the figure in his likeness if they continue on will they? I doubt it! This was the one shot for a Flint to match the rest and he was cheaped out on us.

 

Do the WHOLE 25 in seperate molds FIRST, and THEN resort to retooling and repaints for the continued follow up waves, if it's justified. The use of the exisiting molds for the 2nd versions of CC or SS was one thing, as they're just quick throwaways (unfair to include in the 25 lineup...but oh well) but to do Flint like this is BS!

 

Hasbro pinching pennies so that we MIGHT get another wave, of UNIQUE figures, is a crappy excuse. If they do make more and we get an all NEW mold of a 2nd rate character, how is that going to make the cheap Flint figure less disappointing? There was more to Flint than just his bullet straps, as so many seem to think is all he needed to make him Flint! :rolleyes:

 

Is the anniversary line still bound by the 25 figure "limit"? - I don't think "limit" is the right word, I think "tribute" is much more accurate. Originally, the plan was for a tribute of 25 figures to celebrate the 25 years of G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero. At this point, considering the positive retail and collector reaction, Hasbro may try and sneak another handful of figures into the 2007 assortment.

 

I can't believe Hasbro would have ANY doubt that such an anniversary set would sell EXTREMELY well? So well in fact, that an all out effort and investment, in all new molds, to mark the 25th anniversary of these characters, wouldn't be warranted without their fear of offsetting tooling costs?

 

G.I.Joe ARAH, deserves that effort and investment, especially when it's only 25 of them to begin with. Speculations of future sets or characters doesn't make it less cheap and disappointing.

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And despite that info, people will STILL be complaining about Hasbro's laziness and how they are screwing the fandom with reused parts.

 

 

How is one (or two) persons opinion justifying the practice of repaints in a special anniversary set, considered an excuse that should be accepted and not commented on ANY further?

 

Here's the rationale given...

 

What's with all the repaints already?

 

- Repaints are a necessary aspect of toy manufacturing today to offset tooling costs. That being said, no toyline will thrive in the market if all it relies on are repaints and re-releases of existing tools. Yes, the first wave has alot of repainted characters or re-used tooling, mostly due to the impending schedule of release dates. However, you can rest assured that there will be a dramatic increase in new tooling used starting with the next wave of Single packs. Hasbro realizes that this first wave did take advantage of a lot of existing tooling, but you can be assured that new tools are a certainty in the near future for the anniversary line.

 

That's all fine and dandy...

 

IF..

 

the line does indeed go beyond 25.

 

Nothing has been confirmed on this, and that leaves us only the announced 25 figures of this special anniversary set. I would LOVE for there to be more, but I'm not going to set myself up for more disappointment and instead just take what I kNOW and hope for the best.

 

With that attitude, I can only judge these as I see them, and seeing a great character like Flint, get shortchanged on us, with a reuse of the Duke mold, is STILL disappointing to us Flint fans, who were expecting more. Equal attention to details of uniqueness that the other characters received shouldn't be too much to expect on a 25 set special anniversary edition. More to come or NOT, it stinks.

 

They won't redo the figure in his likeness if they continue on will they? I doubt it! This was the one shot for a Flint to match the rest and he was cheaped out on us.

 

Do the WHOLE 25 in seperate molds FIRST, and THEN resort to retooling and repaints for the continued follow up waves, if it's justified. The use of the exisiting molds for the 2nd versions of CC or SS was one thing, as they're just quick throwaways (unfair to include in the 25 lineup...but oh well) but to do Flint like this is BS!

 

Hasbro pinching pennies so that we MIGHT get another wave, of UNIQUE figures, is a crappy excuse. If they do make more and we get an all NEW mold of a 2nd rate character, how is that going to make the cheap Flint figure less disappointing? There was more to Flint than just his bullet straps, as so many seem to think is all he needed to make him Flint! :rolleyes:

 

Is the anniversary line still bound by the 25 figure "limit"? - I don't think "limit" is the right word, I think "tribute" is much more accurate. Originally, the plan was for a tribute of 25 figures to celebrate the 25 years of G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero. At this point, considering the positive retail and collector reaction, Hasbro may try and sneak another handful of figures into the 2007 assortment.

 

I can't believe Hasbro would have ANY doubt that such an anniversary set would sell EXTREMELY well? So well in fact, that an all out effort and investment, in all new molds, to mark the 25th anniversary of these characters, wouldn't be warranted without their fear of offsetting tooling costs?

 

G.I.Joe ARAH, deserves that effort and investment, especially when it's only 25 of them to begin with. Speculations of future sets or characters doesn't make it less cheap and disappointing.

 

 

That's what *I* have been saying!

 

I don't think ANYONE is upset over the idea of repaints and mold reuses. It is the half-assed job they did with the first ones that doesn't really bode well for future ones.

 

Want to reuse the Storm Shadow mold? Ninja Viper and Satan. Storm Shadow version 2? ....Uh, no. Doesn't look anything LIKE versions 2, except for the "camo scheme." Why make version 1 accurate but not version 2?

 

Admittedly Destro, Gung-Ho and Scarlett have no potential. But even Baroness could be redone as "Chameleon" if they wanted.

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I'm just going to say here that I doubt there will ever be a figure named "Satan" at retail.

 

 

What was it they used, "Satien" or something?

 

Anything that might sound or look like "Satan" is proably out. I heard that Toy Biz wouldn't make a Mephisto figure because he is basicly the devil. (But Marvel Select is making one). Doesn't mean they couldn't do a "Satan" figure. He just won't be called Satan, or any sound alike name. Like Bombstrike is Bombshell she just isn't called that.

 

Now if it was a convention figure you might get away with Satan, because it'd mainly be the retailers that would pitch a fit about a figure named Satan. Not collectors.

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When will we see more pictures? - It may be a little bit. Post Toy Fair is usually a pretty quiet time for product reveals, but as I said earlier, once convention season hits, we'll start getting some more pictures and info, I'm sure. I think we can expect to see packaged pics before the summer season hits, but new product (like Waves 2 and 3) probably won't be until later on in the year.
As long as when they do show pictures they give us alot of new pictures and good stuff, I can wait...

 

Seems like 3 3/4" are getting some steam again! - Both Hasbro and the retailers have been very happy with what has been shown of the Anniversary product so far. If reaction continues to be this positive, anything is possible. One thing's for sure, you're not going to want to miss the Joe Con this year, regardless of what's happening in '08 and beyond, the 25th Anniversary celebration is sure to be huge!

 

Lets keep this reaction positive... even those who may not like them at all, so maybe we can get better products as the line moves on.

 

Is the anniversary line still bound by the 25 figure "limit"? - I don't think "limit" is the right word, I think "tribute" is much more accurate. Originally, the plan was for a tribute of 25 figures to celebrate the 25 years of G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero. At this point, considering the positive retail and collector reaction, Hasbro may try and sneak another handful of figures into the 2007 assortment.

 

Another handful of figures?!?!?! My goodness I can't stand comments like these... they first say that they predict that this line is going positive and looks like it will make them money... then they go on to say that there is a possibility that they will make "a handful of figures into 2007". Why not much more than a handful!!!!

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That's right VH, zero in on the weak target there and hope no one notices. @smilepunch@

 

@hmmm@ "weak tareget" Who? Where?

 

Not sure who you're referring to on that?

 

 

Thought for sure you were going to carve out a flaw in my post, but instead. . .

 

 

;) No way man!

 

Justin is an awesome Joe fan, and I respect him, and love the work he puts into the hobby and the sharing of "info". I might not agree with all of it, whether it's passed along from Hasbro themselves or just a gut reaction on his part, to what might be up in Hasbros minds with all this stuff and Stevy's alright, but he was trying to toss out a..

 

YEAH DAMMIT!! "THAT'S THAT!!"

 

to Justins explaination on the reuse of molds already, like it should all make perfect sense, be UNDERSTOOD and all dissention towards the practice be silenced. Any commenting on it further, about it somehow "screwing the fans" is futile and only shows the naysayer in a bad light and something of a bad, non-supportive Joe fan. :(

 

You just know I GOTTA "carve" that attitude up. @firedevil@

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the only part that bothers me is the little detail here

 

To add to collector excitement, there will also possibly be some minor variants mixed into the single pack line.

 

i hate lines that do this, thats why i pretty much stopped collecting marvel legends and he-man @grumpy@

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Is the anniversary line still bound by the 25 figure "limit"? - I don't think "limit" is the right word, I think "tribute" is much more accurate. Originally, the plan was for a tribute of 25 figures to celebrate the 25 years of G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero. At this point, considering the positive retail and collector reaction, Hasbro may try and sneak another handful of figures into the 2007 assortment.

 

Another handful of figures?!?!?! My goodness I can't stand comments like these... they first say that they predict that this line is going positive and looks like it will make them money... then they go on to say that there is a possibility that they will make "a handful of figures into 2007". Why not much more than a handful!!!!

 

 

Especially seeing how it's a bit of a contradiction, to the theory, that if we accept some retooling, repeated characters and repaints..in the FIRST 25, we'll LIKELY get MORE!

 

That's waaaay too iffy, maybe, just wait a SEE kind of speculating...for me. Assuming the 25 is all there will be, I expect uniques molds and no repeated characters. If it goes beyond that, it would be semi acceptable, but still pretty cheap.

 

They know we're all G.I.Joe NUTS! The 25 set is going to be HUGE!!!

 

Maybe they take all that enthusiasm for granted?

 

newjoesvz9.png

 

 

 

;)

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First of all, Viper Hunter, I appreciate the support...I'm glad to see, that even if you don't agree with what I put out there, at least the effort is appreciated. That's cool to know.

 

Another handful of figures?!?!?! My goodness I can't stand comments like these... they first say that they predict that this line is going positive and looks like it will make them money... then they go on to say that there is a possibility that they will make "a handful of figures into 2007". Why not much more than a handful!!!!
Well, I did say 'for 2007'....Hasbro's plans could very well grow exponentially next year, though I don't know if they will. Folks have to consider that these toys are planned and conceived of sometimes over a year in advance! This stuff was being worked out in mid or early 2006. At that point they had no idea how it would be received by retailers, or even if retailers would pick it up. They have to play it smart.

 

The anniversary line isn't even starting until July/August. Getting 25-30 new figures in a 4 month span ain't too shabby!

 

Especially seeing how it's a bit of a contradiction, to the theory, that if we accept some retooling, repeated characters and repaints..in the FIRST 25, we'll LIKELY get MORE!

 

No offense, but...well... yeah. Isn't that the way G.I. Joe (as a toyline) has operated since it's inception? Even throughout the classic line we repeatedly saw tooling reused for other figures. Throughout the DTC line (that everyone now seems to label as 'the best thing evah' just because it got cancelled) all we got was mostly retooled and reused molds...and now that Wave 4 is cancelled, fans are FREAKING that we're not getting those figures. Yet somehow using the same practice in this Joe line is unwarranted?

 

Personally, I think it's a good sign that tooling is being reused. Why? Because that's how Hasbro operates with every ongoing itteration of the 3 3/4" product that they've put out. It's been common practice, so I have no idea why everyone is so shocked and appalled that it's happening here. To me it's a sign that they're treating the anniversary line as a potential continuous line, and not a "one and done" type of scenario.

 

The first wave of single packs has a TON of reused tooling. It's unfortunate, but it was necessary. Sometimes deadlines necessitate that. Personally, I think even though they're working within a limited budget and limited timetable, they still did fantastic work with what they had to work with.

 

Trust me on this, guys...Hasbro is taking this new 3 3/4" concept VERY seriously. They are working very hard to put out the best possible product they can with the external retailer limits that they have. I think by the time this year ends, fans will be VERY happy with the end product and with what's to come in future waves.

 

I love what I see so far, and I know to everyone I'm a shameless Hasbro shill, but I'm really hoping this thread is kept in the archives, because in December, 2007 I want to bring it back up so I can tell everyone 'see what I mean'? ;)

 

Justin

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I'm just going to say here that I doubt there will ever be a figure named "Satan" at retail.

 

 

What was it they used, "Satien" or something?

 

Anything that might sound or look like "Satan" is proably out. I heard that Toy Biz wouldn't make a Mephisto figure because he is basicly the devil. (But Marvel Select is making one). Doesn't mean they couldn't do a "Satan" figure. He just won't be called Satan, or any sound alike name. Like Bombstrike is Bombshell she just isn't called that.

 

Now if it was a convention figure you might get away with Satan, because it'd mainly be the retailers that would pitch a fit about a figure named Satan. Not collectors.

 

I dunno. I mean Mephisto IS the devil (technically). This is just a guy who uses the name "Satan". They could just make it "sound oriental" like T'Gin-Zu or T'jbang. Maybe Sat'ien or something. Doesn't matter too much. They could just throw it onto the filecard who he "really" is.

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First of all, Viper Hunter, I appreciate the support...I'm glad to see, that even if you don't agree with what I put out there, at least the effort is appreciated. That's cool to know.

 

Another handful of figures?!?!?! My goodness I can't stand comments like these... they first say that they predict that this line is going positive and looks like it will make them money... then they go on to say that there is a possibility that they will make "a handful of figures into 2007". Why not much more than a handful!!!!
Well, I did say 'for 2007'....Hasbro's plans could very well grow exponentially next year, though I don't know if they will. Folks have to consider that these toys are planned and conceived of sometimes over a year in advance! This stuff was being worked out in mid or early 2006. At that point they had no idea how it would be received by retailers, or even if retailers would pick it up. They have to play it smart.

 

The anniversary line isn't even starting until July/August. Getting 25-30 new figures in a 4 month span ain't too shabby!

 

Especially seeing how it's a bit of a contradiction, to the theory, that if we accept some retooling, repeated characters and repaints..in the FIRST 25, we'll LIKELY get MORE!
No offense, but...well... yeah. Isn't that the way G.I. Joe (as a toyline) has operated since it's inception? Even throughout the classic line we repeatedly saw tooling reused for other figures. Throughout the DTC line (that everyone now seems to label as 'the best thing evah' just because it got cancelled) all we got was mostly retooled and reused molds...and now that Wave 4 is cancelled, fans are FREAKING that we're not getting those figures. Yet somehow using the same practice in this Joe line is unwarranted?

 

Personally, I think it's a good sign that tooling is being reused. Why? Because that's how Hasbro operates with every ongoing itteration of the 3 3/4" product that they've put out. It's been common practice, so I have no idea why everyone is so shocked and appalled that it's happening here. To me it's a sign that they're treating the anniversary line as a potential continuous line, and not a "one and done" type of scenario.

 

The first wave of single packs has a TON of reused tooling. It's unfortunate, but it was necessary. Sometimes deadlines necessitate that. Personally, I think even though they're working within a limited budget and limited timetable, they still did fantastic work with what they had to work with.

 

Trust me on this, guys...Hasbro is taking this new 3 3/4" concept VERY seriously. They are working very hard to put out the best possible product they can with the external retailer limits that they have. I think by the time this year ends, fans will be VERY happy with the end product and with what's to come in future waves.

 

I love what I see so far, and I know to everyone I'm a shameless Hasbro shill, but I'm really hoping this thread is kept in the archives, because in December, 2007 I want to bring it back up so I can tell everyone 'see what I mean'? ;)

 

Justin

 

I disagree, to an extent. As my previously used example of Storm Shadow illustrates. If they were talking it seriously, Storm Shadow version 2 would LOOK LIKE STORM SHADOW VERSION 2. Not Storm Shadow version 1 with a different head. Or Snake Eyes wouldn't look like version 1 with a visor. The two molds for each of those characters are quite dramatically different.

 

I'm all for reusing molds. More often then not the "new" character is better than then the original use of the mold. Low-Light, for example, used the mold much better than "Chief" Torpedo. I would just prefer they used the molds CORRECTLY. Again, as I mentioned above, Storm Shadow could have been reused as Ninja Viper and Satan (or whatever they wish to call him now). Snake Eyes would have been perfect for Stalker and Grunt. Cobra Commander, at least, works.

 

I really see NO need to have repeats of them, popular or not, THIS EARLY. Yes, the point is to attract new customers. But it is also to please the old customers too. Want a repeat? Fine, do them...later.

 

And, off the top of my head, the only full-body reuse from RAH (not counting sub-team repaints) was the Sky Patrol. Normally, Hasbro would mix-match parts to create new characters. Yes every single part may have come from some other character (rather than brand new), but it usually didn't just look like any of those other characters with a new outfit. Claymore shared parts from Footloose (head), Tele-Viper, Flint and Dusty. Rumbler shared parts from Footloose (head), Heavy Metal and Bazooka...but NONE of them looked like they were twins. Claymore and Rumbler didn't look like "Footloose with a new outfit". Then look at the DTC S.A.W. Viper. They reused the ENTIRE Rollbar mold. If this was Spytroops, that woulda been perfect.

 

Now, I'm sure the 25th stuff is much harder to "customize" then the o-ring stuff. Fine. But is it that hard to mix-match the parts that CAN be changed? Does Flint HAVE to reuse all of Duke's body? They couldn't, just for a quick example, throw on Roadblock's arms? Or just mold new ones since 75% of the body is reused?

 

 

In the end, I don't think we will have much to complain about (though we WILL, that's what fans do), as you said, a year from now. But that depends on just how serious Hasbro is on making a quality product. "Wave 1" is quality, from what we have seen. "Wave 2" well, not such good quality. What will waves 3+ look like? Good quality...or not so good?

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I'm actually a little worried that since they didn't sculpt new arms for Flint that we won't see a Spirit. Cause they have almost the exact same upper arms. So they more then likely would have shared an arm mold. Since Flint has Duke's arms, must mean there wasn't a set of Spirit arms to share with him yet. That or it means Spirit is going to be yet another almost straight repaint of Duke.

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