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El Kabong

Why no Batman?

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Wow. Didn't think this one would go the distance. Anyway, I don't seriously expect to see a Bat signal one day. I just wondered what everyone thought about the idea that a looney tune might one day go the route of masked hero instead of serial killer. I know it's not a feasible solution to crime, but it would be an interesting one. I wonder if DC or Warners would sue the guy? Copyright infringement? Trademark violation?

 

 

Criminals are not only a superstitious, cowardly lot, they tend to be really stupid too.

Unfortunately, a vigilante would probably be much the same, because a smart person would really be able to see what they are up against in trying to tackle crime as a vigilante--even if they had the resouces.

It just isn't feasible for a wealthy person ( or anyone)to act in that manner.

 

 

 

Why is it when you brought that up about wondering about vigilantes,the name of Benard Goetz(that was the name of that nutcase on the subway in NYC in the 80s,wasn't it?) popped into my mind?

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I love this thread. Really fun discussion. I, personally, hope a batman does come along. For entertainment's sake, at least.

 

Unfortunately, it's not really probable though.

 

1. Though there are indeed many people in this world, few are as physically capable as Batman and even fewer have the, not only training but, skill that Batman has.

 

2. No one is as lucky as Batman is. Call it brains or brawn, dodging bullets and not getting stabbed or shot in a fight with four attackers is not as simple as he makes it look.

 

3. Equipment is expensive. No one wants to go out there unarmed, and the less hand-to-hand combat training you have, the more you rely on weapons. The more you rely on weapons, the more you need to know how to use them, and you can't leap around when you're loaded down with weapons. Technology, even for the wealthy, is not as up to date as it is in the Batman universe. Tools of Batman's calibur would need to be custom made and even then, I don't believe it would work out logistically.

 

4. Assuming one will take injuries in even a single fight, one would need to account for recovery time. The human body can only take so much punishment. It needs time to heal. Between sickness and injury, one would be inactive more days than he or she would be fighting crime.

 

But if anyone can rise above these challenges, all the power to this person.

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Why is it when you brought that up about wondering about vigilantes,the name of Benard Goetz(that was the name of that nutcase on the subway in NYC in the 80s,wasn't it?) popped into my mind?

Goetz (sp?) was caught, tired and convicted, iirc, for the shooting of the persons trying to assault him.

He didn't go about it the way Batman does, that's for sure--but he's a good example of how vigilanteism fails.

 

3. Equipment is expensive. No one wants to go out there unarmed, and the less hand-to-hand combat training you have, the more you rely on weapons. The more you rely on weapons, the more you need to know how to use them, and you can't leap around when you're loaded down with weapons. Technology, even for the wealthy, is not as up to date as it is in the Batman universe. Tools of Batman's calibur would need to be custom made and even then, I don't believe it would work out logistically.

 

Yep, and the more sophisticated the gear, the longer the paper trail it leaves behind because complex gear is expensive and requires R&D. Someone has to make it because the applied sciences are waaaaaaaaaaaay too many for a single person to learn AND maintain profiency in criminology, martial arts AND a disguised lifestyle.

 

Want to drive a Batmobile? Unless you get George Barris to build you one, you'd have to hand-make the thing yourself to avoid leaving markers of where it came from and who it was sold to. People that want to find other people are REALLY good at digging up the trails of people that don't want to be found by others.

 

Batman's logistics support is fantasy. How does he refuel the Batmobile, for example? Where does that fuel comes from? Assuming its a petroleum-type of fuel, someone has to physically come to the Wayne property and fill up a tank, and then account for the amounts and kind of fuel used with a cagey explaination. There's a person and paper trail there--and such trails can be traced and suspicion brought to bear.

If the powerplant for the car uses something exotic--say nuclear powered--again......that's not something that can he had off the shelf. Nuke items tend to be tracked--for good reasons. The technology to support and safeguard the item and people using it is complex and involved.

 

Its long been written that Batman has the best equipment that money can buy, and steadfastly plugs the holes in the veil of secrecy he maintains around him, but..........think about that?

Think about how extensive that veil must be and how much effort must go into maintaining it.

New technologies get reported all the time.

A "gizmo X" can appear in a article in a paper or magazine, and then disappear.........and then all of a sudden its showing up in Gotham city being used by Batman. Analysts, like those in the CIA, NSA and FBI, spend careers looking for patterns like this amongst people.

The direction of evidence creates patterns that lead to one specific locale, and one specific person. Logical conclusions would be formed and scrutiny would be placed upon certain people.

It would be easy to conclude that if Batman is getting this fancy gear, then he must be getting it from some patron, or by his own means. If he has means, then that shows he ( or his patron) resides within Gotham city, because he operates therein.

Given that, the list of people with means narrows. Once you have the means, then look for a motive. Bruce Wayne's family tragedy is well known--so then you have the motive.

He leads a idyllic life-style where his comings and goings are inconsistent, so then you have opportunity--hence a classic profile breakdown. In a real-world sense, uncovering WHO a "Batman" would be wouldn't be that difficult--if someone had the means to actually be Batman.

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Why is it when you brought that up about wondering about vigilantes,the name of Benard Goetz(that was the name of that nutcase on the subway in NYC in the 80s,wasn't it?) popped into my mind?

Goetz (sp?) was caught, tired and convicted, iirc, for the shooting of the persons trying to assault him.

He didn't go about it the way Batman does, that's for sure--but he's a good example of how vigilanteism fails.

 

wtf dude! the man was defending himself. i would have killed all those pricks (don't remember the whole story but i think it was maybe 3-4 of them). the man was minding his business, he did not ask to be mugged. seriously, if you had a knife pointed right in your face and had to means to defend yourself you wouldn't do the same thing? you would call the cops and just wait for 30 mins to 1 hr before someone even bothers to show up or worse, you could be laying there bleeding to death.

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wtf dude! the man was defending himself. i would have killed all those pricks (don't remember the whole story but i think it was maybe 3-4 of them). the man was minding his business, he did not ask to be mugged. seriously, if you had a knife pointed right in your face and had to means to defend yourself you wouldn't do the same thing? you would call the cops and just wait for 30 mins to 1 hr before someone even bothers to show up or worse, you could be laying there bleeding to death.

 

I wasn't questioning his moral choice, or his actions. He "failed" because he used excessive force, iirc, an issue of the case that is STILL debated.

No one has said he was unjustified in defending himself, the degree to which he did so came into question.

THAT is the sticky point with regards to vigilantes--there's no checks or balances with them as regard to their response. With police, at least there's training and standards that are typically held to.

The average person lacks such training, such intuitions and can easily counter all out of proportion to the assault on their person.

In a "just" sense, the perps that tried to attack Goetz probably got what they deserved, but because none of them actually laid a hand on Goetz, there's no way to ascertain whether they posed a actual threat or a percieved threat. Goetz shot them before they could attack him.

The Goetz case wasn't a matter of justice, it was a matter of law.

 

Now, if you had taken the infamous"wilding" victim example: and if that woman had somehow found some kind of inner strength to fight back and take on her attackers--even killed some of them, there'd be no argument as to her defending herself--to the point of taking her assailants lives. That would be a matter of justice WITHIN the law.

The threat to her can be easily established, and she is released from the normal moral constraints to defend herself.

It is still uncertain if Goetz was in a similar position.

 

Goetz also had a history of either run-ins with muggers, or a deep seating attitude against them, which lead to speculation of POSSIBLE pre-meditation.

He was carrying a gun for a reason, and was found to be prepared to use it--on someone.

Why? There's still no clear answers for that.

 

That is why, in his case, being a vigilante failed.

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I am a big Batman fan, not just for the coolness of the character but i believe in what he fights for, as said in the Justic Lords Episode, " I do what i do so no 8 year old can see his parents be murdered." (not a direct quote but you get the point)

 

This is the real world and unfortunatly no one is that good (as in physical and mental training, fiances to support and hiding the fact of who you are.

 

Arrow is right in the sense that we live in a VERY nosey world, someone somewhere would find something and blow the lid off it all...

 

Who knows maybe there is a "Batman" in every city maybe there is not, but all in all we will never know!

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I agree with all of you on this. There is no way a person could be Batman, and remain uncaught or hindered by law enforcement. The governmental agencies that would be brought in would find him or her easily with the paper trail or profiling techniques that have been used to bring in nearly every homocidal maniac out there.

 

But I'm still left wondering, why we haven't heard about someone TRYING to be Batman. It seems like everyone who has psychological issues either becomes a pedophile, or a serial killer or a gun toting lunatic, etc etc. I know if you put on the cape and cowl and tried to be Batman you'd either wind up dead, or severly beaten. Or even more likely you'd be in jail toot sweet. But if you're mentally unstable or unhinged, there is little reason not to think, "hey! I could be Batman!!"

 

It reminds me of a Snickers commerical a few years back where a QB is sacked hard and the team docs come out and check to see if his head still faces forward. They ask where he is, what he's doing and he responds appropriately. They then ask who is he, and he responds

 

"I'm Batman."

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I agree with all of you on this. There is no way a person could be Batman, and remain uncaught or hindered by law enforcement. The governmental agencies that would be brought in would find him or her easily with the paper trail or profiling techniques that have been used to bring in nearly every homocidal maniac out there.

 

But I'm still left wondering, why we haven't heard about someone TRYING to be Batman. It seems like everyone who has psychological issues either becomes a pedophile, or a serial killer or a gun toting lunatic, etc etc. I know if you put on the cape and cowl and tried to be Batman you'd either wind up dead, or severly beaten. Or even more likely you'd be in jail toot sweet. But if you're mentally unstable or unhinged, there is little reason not to think, "hey! I could be Batman!!"

 

It reminds me of a Snickers commerical a few years back where a QB is sacked hard and the team docs come out and check to see if his head still faces forward. They ask where he is, what he's doing and he responds appropriately. They then ask who is he, and he responds

 

"I'm Batman."

 

 

 

 

You answered your own question why no one is trying to be Batman. Also others have told you why no one is trying to be Batman. Why is is so hard to accept that as crazy as some people may be they don't live in a comic book fantasy land where they want to dress up like a super hero ane run around jumping off rooftops looking for crime to fight.

 

There is copywrite infingment DC comics owns the rights to batman, federal agencies would get involved if anyone did do it and it invites the REAL nut jobs to become the Joker or worse. There are vigilanties out in the world who don't need costumes. They act in the way Charles Bronson did in all his death wish movies and they look like you and me. they just take the law into their own hands and that is wrong.

 

You don't need a costumed crime fighter in the REAL world El Kabong. I know you really understand this so why keep saying but why couldn't someone try to be Batman? etc, etc. Yes those of use in this forum who said I would do it in a second if i could know they wouldn't really do it and it just sounds glamerous to think what if I could. The adventures I could have etc, etc. But we all have to stop daydreaming and come back to reality and live in the real world where Batman and all other super heroes only exist in Comic Books.

 

Besides Bruce wayne didn't just deside to be Batman, He saw his parents murdered before his very eyes as a child and he had a huge fear of bats so he became the very thing he feared to instill fear into the low life thugs of Gotham city. That's why it won't work in the real world El Kabong. Bruce Wayne had something to prove. It makes for great reading and had been great reading and cartoons for many years. Let's leave Batman where he belongs.

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I agree with all of you on this. There is no way a person could be Batman, and remain uncaught or hindered by law enforcement. The governmental agencies that would be brought in would find him or her easily with the paper trail or profiling techniques that have been used to bring in nearly every homocidal maniac out there.

 

But I'm still left wondering, why we haven't heard about someone TRYING to be Batman. It seems like everyone who has psychological issues either becomes a pedophile, or a serial killer or a gun toting lunatic, etc etc. I know if you put on the cape and cowl and tried to be Batman you'd either wind up dead, or severly beaten. Or even more likely you'd be in jail toot sweet. But if you're mentally unstable or unhinged, there is little reason not to think, "hey! I could be Batman!!"

 

It reminds me of a Snickers commerical a few years back where a QB is sacked hard and the team docs come out and check to see if his head still faces forward. They ask where he is, what he's doing and he responds appropriately. They then ask who is he, and he responds

 

"I'm Batman."

 

 

 

 

You answered your own question why no one is trying to be Batman. Also others have told you why no one is trying to be Batman. Why is is so hard to accept that as crazy as some people may be they don't live in a comic book fantasy land where they want to dress up like a super hero ane run around jumping off rooftops looking for crime to fight.

 

There is copywrite infingment DC comics owns the rights to batman, federal agencies would get involved if anyone did do it and it invites the REAL nut jobs to become the Joker or worse. There are vigilanties out in the world who don't need costumes. They act in the way Charles Bronson did in all his death wish movies and they look like you and me. they just take the law into their own hands and that is wrong.

 

You don't need a costumed crime fighter in the REAL world El Kabong. I know you really understand this so why keep saying but why couldn't someone try to be Batman? etc, etc. Yes those of use in this forum who said I would do it in a second if i could know they wouldn't really do it and it just sounds glamerous to think what if I could. The adventures I could have etc, etc. But we all have to stop daydreaming and come back to reality and live in the real world where Batman and all other super heroes only exist in Comic Books.

 

Besides Bruce wayne didn't just deside to be Batman, He saw his parents murdered before his very eyes as a child and he had a huge fear of bats so he became the very thing he feared to instill fear into the low life thugs of Gotham city. That's why it won't work in the real world El Kabong. Bruce Wayne had something to prove. It makes for great reading and had been great reading and cartoons for many years. Let's leave Batman where he belongs.

 

Do you have something against me, or this idea in general? I'm just providing interesting conversation amongst the many people who come to the board to share their love of DC Comics and it's related properties. You seem to be very negative when it comes to this thread. If I did something to offend you, I sincerely apologize. No sarcasim intended here. I know the internet does not lend itself to honesty all the time, but I'm really sorry if I did something to you to inspire this kind of treatment.

 

There are several people who have responded to my original question and seem to be generally interested. They have each given lengthy posts on this topic, each one grounded in the real world. Moreover, the entire topic for all of these boards, be it He-Man, G.I.Joe, DC or Marvel are all about daydreaming. If we all went back to reality and left the fantastic behind there would be no magic left, no creativity, no sense of wonder. These boards would not exist. So, I apologize for still feeling like a kid and being a little immature at times. But that's who I am, and we're all a little like that inside. Otherwise we wouldn't be buying toys and reading comic books in the first place. So I'm going to continue to daydream and imagine a world full of impossibilities. You should try it some time.

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I agree with all of you on this. There is no way a person could be Batman, and remain uncaught or hindered by law enforcement. The governmental agencies that would be brought in would find him or her easily with the paper trail or profiling techniques that have been used to bring in nearly every homocidal maniac out there.

 

But I'm still left wondering, why we haven't heard about someone TRYING to be Batman. It seems like everyone who has psychological issues either becomes a pedophile, or a serial killer or a gun toting lunatic, etc etc. I know if you put on the cape and cowl and tried to be Batman you'd either wind up dead, or severly beaten. Or even more likely you'd be in jail toot sweet. But if you're mentally unstable or unhinged, there is little reason not to think, "hey! I could be Batman!!"

 

It reminds me of a Snickers commerical a few years back where a QB is sacked hard and the team docs come out and check to see if his head still faces forward. They ask where he is, what he's doing and he responds appropriately. They then ask who is he, and he responds

 

"I'm Batman."

 

 

 

 

You answered your own question why no one is trying to be Batman. Also others have told you why no one is trying to be Batman. Why is is so hard to accept that as crazy as some people may be they don't live in a comic book fantasy land where they want to dress up like a super hero ane run around jumping off rooftops looking for crime to fight.

 

There is copywrite infingment DC comics owns the rights to batman, federal agencies would get involved if anyone did do it and it invites the REAL nut jobs to become the Joker or worse. There are vigilanties out in the world who don't need costumes. They act in the way Charles Bronson did in all his death wish movies and they look like you and me. they just take the law into their own hands and that is wrong.

 

You don't need a costumed crime fighter in the REAL world El Kabong. I know you really understand this so why keep saying but why couldn't someone try to be Batman? etc, etc. Yes those of use in this forum who said I would do it in a second if i could know they wouldn't really do it and it just sounds glamerous to think what if I could. The adventures I could have etc, etc. But we all have to stop daydreaming and come back to reality and live in the real world where Batman and all other super heroes only exist in Comic Books.

 

Besides Bruce wayne didn't just deside to be Batman, He saw his parents murdered before his very eyes as a child and he had a huge fear of bats so he became the very thing he feared to instill fear into the low life thugs of Gotham city. That's why it won't work in the real world El Kabong. Bruce Wayne had something to prove. It makes for great reading and had been great reading and cartoons for many years. Let's leave Batman where he belongs.

 

Do you have something against me, or this idea in general? I'm just providing interesting conversation amongst the many people who come to the board to share their love of DC Comics and it's related properties. You seem to be very negative when it comes to this thread. If I did something to offend you, I sincerely apologize. No sarcasim intended here. I know the internet does not lend itself to honesty all the time, but I'm really sorry if I did something to you to inspire this kind of treatment.

 

There are several people who have responded to my original question and seem to be generally interested. They have each given lengthy posts on this topic, each one grounded in the real world. Moreover, the entire topic for all of these boards, be it He-Man, G.I.Joe, DC or Marvel are all about daydreaming. If we all went back to reality and left the fantastic behind there would be no magic left, no creativity, no sense of wonder. These boards would not exist. So, I apologize for still feeling like a kid and being a little immature at times. But that's who I am, and we're all a little like that inside. Otherwise we wouldn't be buying toys and reading comic books in the first place. So I'm going to continue to daydream and imagine a world full of impossibilities. You should try it some time.

No I have nothing against you personally El kabong. I don't know you and I have nothing against you. To still be a kid at hart is great I too am a kid at heart or i wouldn't still collect action figures. If I offened you I'm sorry. I have nothing against a good converstation I guess it's the Idea you tossed out here of a real vigilante a screw loose person to really become batman that turned me off. The world is full of nutjobs and to think someone like that might acctually be a forum member reading this and going out and trying that stuff just didn't sit well with me. I love Batman and all the other superheroes El Kabong I just got turned off to the idea of a real Batman as for me it just takes away from the comics , Cartoons and toys. That being said please don't think I'm bashing you. I'm sure you are a very nice person. Sorry If my oppinion came off as negative.

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