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I Thnk I Might Be Leaving Gi Joe, Yet Again!!!


Lady Jaye
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Once you have each and every character of the past "20 years" and you have them in their "classic design", wouldn't the collection be complete and done with?

 

Better to keep collections relatively small and simple. Like me with the TFs... I really only want the classic ones from '84-'86. Even if I only collect reissues and Alternators, this still isn't "quick". Plus they have "updated" homages in other lines, and mini-sized G1 TFs as well... There's still a whole lot to get.

 

GI Joe, well... there really isn't. I'd like to see GI Joe become as popular as TFs right now, so we could get to that point, but it just isn't there. They aren't giving what every collector wants right now, and they're going to lose business because of it.

I have zero interest in tranforming trucks and animals into robots! @lol@

 

That toyline is for another breed, well after my time! G.I.Joe of the ARAH 80's era struck a nostalgia chord with me, and i've just keep up with it, because it's cool and fun. I'm sure TF's are as well.....to somebody else, just not me.

 

Hasbro has actually been doing a lot, to give all the collectors a little bit of something they like, in their many different preferences. So that's pretty cool in my book. Arguing that they need to do MORE in any section of it, is just something left to the collectors to fuss about, but at least I see the variety out there.

 

I think they're "slacking" somewhat,on the ARAH reissues or TRU exclusives,that feature the classic stuff, but that's another issue in itself.

 

There's MORE variety of Joe stuff out there right now, than I've seen in quite some time, so I'm not following your argument I guess.

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I don't see the facination with the '82 figures since alot of them all shared the same body sculpt which I found quite bland.

Agreed!

 

Having picked the carded figure of Flint up, while browsing a KB store in a mall, back in the day when he first showed up on the pegs, I can tell you my reaction was of FLABBERGASTATION (if that's such a word?)

 

That's when the figures REALLY took off for me and became even more detailed and articulated.

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Alternators are what I would call the equivalent of "Marvel Legends style" '80s Joes, that that one guy is doing customs with.

To me, BinalTech/Alternators is to Transformers as JvC is to GI Joe. Same characters with new bodies, just done right. I think Binal Tech has been handled pretty well so far. Also, consider things like Masterpiece Optimus Prime... !!!

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And what is it every collector wants?

 

Remember, you can please some of them some of the time but you can't please all of them all of the time.

 

What I meant by "every collector" wasn't in the collective sense. I didn't mean "every collector wants this or that".

 

What I meant was that they aren't appealing to every KIND of collector. There are the hard core buy-anything GI Joe guys, and there are the more selective ones. There are those who army-build, and there are those who just want one of every figure. There are those who don't care about vehicles, etc...

 

But more specifically, you have guys who are into the old 12-inch Joes, and you have ones who are into 3 3/4" Joes. And out of those, you have a increasingly large number who are not hard-core collectors, but who remember the stuff they grew up with and want them back, like me and, I suspect, LJ. This group is at an age now where they're making money, but Hasbro doesn't seem to get that. Now look at TFs - they have a number of lines that appeal to different sorts of collectors, and one that is the most prevalent one is the "retro" side of things. Energon has homages. Alternators are what I would call the equivalent of "Marvel Legends style" '80s Joes, that that one guy is doing customs with. And then you have the straight-up reissues.

Ah, I see.

 

But isn't that the point of the comic packs and the TRU 6-packs?

 

I think G.I. Joe is doing just fine with regard to all the different collectors out there, given the limitations we have today.

 

Like I said, you can't please everyone all the time.

 

So, what would you have them do better to appeal more to those collectors you think are being disenfranchised and/or ignored?

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Arguing that they need to do MORE in any section of it, is just something left to the collectors to fuss about, but at least I see the variety out there.

 

I think they're "slacking" somewhat,on the ARAH reissues or TRU exclusives,that feature the classic stuff, but that's another issue in itself.

Very true.

 

As a fan, I just want more, better, and the stuff to come out faster [while having good distribution].

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Ah, I see.

 

But isn't that the point of the comic packs and the TRU 6-packs?

 

I think G.I. Joe is doing just fine with regard to all the different collectors out there, given the limitations we have today.

 

Like I said, you can't please everyone all the time.

 

So, what would you have them do better to appeal more to those collectors you think are being disenfranchised and/or ignored?

 

Yeah, the comic packs are a step in the right direction. TRU 6-packs... almost. The only one that was done right in my opinion was the Cobra infantry, although I the ninja one is pretty cool, too.

 

To me, BinalTech/Alternators is to Transformers as JvC is to GI Joe. Same characters with new bodies, just done right. I think Binal Tech has been handled pretty well so far. Also, consider things like Masterpiece Optimus Prime... !!!

 

I have to disagree with you there. I don't think the Joe Vs. Cobra figures are the characters "done right" at all. I don't mean that as a slander to the line - I would equate that with TF Armada or Energon - basically the same characters, but done quite differently and for a new generation.

 

This is what I would do:

 

1. keep the comic packs going strong, reissue vehicles with comic-style figures to go with them.

 

2. keep the VVV line going in the direction it seems to be heading with the upcoming waves - it looks like the quality's getting better. Maybe instead of doing ML style figures, get the sculpting up to those standards on the 3 3/4" figures. Stay true to any old character they decide to do.

 

3. release stuff to appeal to the 12" collectors as well.

 

4. try to release a good videogame to tie people in to the line

 

5. see if we can't get a good series on TV with the old characters... maybe something like the new MotU or TMNT shows.

 

6. tie stuff in with the new TV show.

 

7. I'd keep the TRU 6-packs going, but release more army-builders and "good" sets.

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Ah, I see.

 

But isn't that the point of the comic packs and the TRU 6-packs?

 

I think G.I. Joe is doing just fine with regard to all the different collectors out there, given the limitations we have today.

 

Like I said, you can't please everyone all the time.

 

So, what would you have them do better to appeal more to those collectors you think are being disenfranchised and/or ignored?

 

Yeah, the comic packs are a step in the right direction. TRU 6-packs... almost. The only one that was done right in my opinion was the Cobra infantry, although I the ninja one is pretty cool, too.

 

To me, BinalTech/Alternators is to Transformers as JvC is to GI Joe. Same characters with new bodies, just done right. I think Binal Tech has been handled pretty well so far. Also, consider things like Masterpiece Optimus Prime... !!!

 

I have to disagree with you there. I don't think the Joe Vs. Cobra figures are the characters "done right" at all. I don't mean that as a slander to the line - I would equate that with TF Armada or Energon - basically the same characters, but done quite differently and for a new generation.

 

This is what I would do:

 

1. keep the comic packs going strong, reissue vehicles with comic-style figures to go with them.

 

2. keep the VVV line going in the direction it seems to be heading with the upcoming waves - it looks like the quality's getting better. Maybe instead of doing ML style figures, get the sculpting up to those standards on the 3 3/4" figures. Stay true to any old character they decide to do.

 

3. release stuff to appeal to the 12" collectors as well.

 

4. try to release a good videogame to tie people in to the line

 

5. see if we can't get a good series on TV with the old characters... maybe something like the new MotU or TMNT shows.

 

6. tie stuff in with the new TV show.

 

7. I'd keep the TRU 6-packs going, but release more army-builders and "good" sets.

What about the Python Patrol pack?

 

They tried the 80s characters in the 12" line. It didn't work.

 

You seem to be saying two things, IMO, about the new sculpts. One - that they aren't recognizeable to their RAH versions. Two - that the quality is lacking. That seems to be two different things.

 

For one, as I said before, WHICH RAH version should they "stay true to?" Snake Eyes, for example, has had FOUR different and distinct molds (five if you include Ninja Force). Which of the FOUR Snake Eyes versions do they make the new sculpt resemble?

 

For two, quality, it seems to me you are talking about the physical quality (plastic and paint apps). RAH wasn't superior. How many broken crotches and thumbs have you seen? How many cracked elbows?

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there's a bridge near by you somewhere use it

Christ dude, that was way out of line.

 

Even I dont kick someone when they're down. Maybe when they arent looking but telling that to someone who's unhappy is anathema to me, even if we HAVE butted heads. Distasteful

 

Go away and come back when youve learned some humanity, jerkweed.

 

 

As for Zartan and Firefly being ninjas, I dont veiw them as such. I see it as them just having a history with the clan. Firefly doesnt see himself as a ninja, he just joined long enough to upgrade his infiltration skills. You never see him do any real ninja junk. And Zartan was never a member of the clan, he just apprenticed for the swordmaker. Zarty has mad archery skills and maybe some swordsman skill, but you can learn that elsewhere. So you really dont need to worry on that issue.

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Sorry to see you go again LJ. I remember your last send off at devilsdue I think. Anyway I think you are just trying to hold onto your childhood to hard. Just because the figure doesn't look the same its the same character. As long as you think they look cool it shouldn't matter if they look different. I think a lot of the new figures are better designed than any RAH version, Scarlett just being one example.

Best of luck with ML, the worst line to track down going. It saps a lot of fun out of it.

Draven

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What about the Python Patrol pack?

 

They tried the 80s characters in the 12" line. It didn't work.

 

You seem to be saying two things, IMO, about the new sculpts. One - that they aren't recognizeable to their RAH versions. Two - that the quality is lacking. That seems to be two different things.

 

For one, as I said before, WHICH RAH version should they "stay true to?" Snake Eyes, for example, has had FOUR different and distinct molds (five if you include Ninja Force). Which of the FOUR Snake Eyes versions do they make the new sculpt resemble?

 

For two, quality, it seems to me you are talking about the physical quality (plastic and paint apps). RAH wasn't superior. How many broken crotches and thumbs have you seen? How many cracked elbows?

 

I didn't mean to the '80s characters in the 12" line - I meant just release stuff to appeal to the fans of the older stuff, that's all.

 

When I'm talking about the quality, yes I am basically talking about those two things. I wasn't saying that the RAH stuff was better quality. I was talking more about paint applications today, that seems to have suffered quite a bit. It really should be at least to the standards of the SW stuff.

 

As for the sculpts, I think that right now would be a good time to go back to the time when RAH was most popular, and they should reflect that time. So yes, it would be an amalgamation of the years from '83ish to around the time of the movie. After that, it seemed pretty obvious that GI Joe was taking a dive. And yeah, Snake-Eyes had four different sculpts, but he really is the exception to the rule, as he was an extremely popular character.

 

However, I think most people agree that the V2 mold is the one we'd all want to see! ;)

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What about the Python Patrol pack?

 

They tried the 80s characters in the 12" line. It didn't work.

 

You seem to be saying two things, IMO, about the new sculpts. One - that they aren't recognizeable to their RAH versions. Two - that the quality is lacking. That seems to be two different things.

 

For one, as I said before, WHICH RAH version should they "stay true to?" Snake Eyes, for example, has had FOUR different and distinct molds (five if you include Ninja Force). Which of the FOUR Snake Eyes versions do they make the new sculpt resemble?

 

For two, quality, it seems to me you are talking about the physical quality (plastic and paint apps). RAH wasn't superior. How many broken crotches and thumbs have you seen? How many cracked elbows?

 

I didn't mean to the '80s characters in the 12" line - I meant just release stuff to appeal to the fans of the older stuff, that's all.

 

When I'm talking about the quality, yes I am basically talking about those two things. I wasn't saying that the RAH stuff was better quality. I was talking more about paint applications today, that seems to have suffered quite a bit. It really should be at least to the standards of the SW stuff.

 

As for the sculpts, I think that right now would be a good time to go back to the time when RAH was most popular, and they should reflect that time. So yes, it would be an amalgamation of the years from '83ish to around the time of the movie. After that, it seemed pretty obvious that GI Joe was taking a dive. And yeah, Snake-Eyes had four different sculpts, but he really is the exception to the rule, as he was an extremely popular character.

 

However, I think most people agree that the V2 mold is the one we'd all want to see! ;)

I see TONS of 12" stuff around here. Nobody seems to buy it...

 

I agree, paint apps are pretty bad with the new line (Hard Drive comes to mind).

 

 

And Snake Eyes WASN'T the acception. Stalker had 4 molds, Cobra Commander 7, Duke 4, Destro 4, Gung-Ho 3, among others. A lot of people like the version 2 Stalker, even though the version 1 is more "classic" Stalker. What about all the people that like the OTHER versions of Snake Eyes over version 2?

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I see TONS of 12" stuff around here. Nobody seems to buy it...

 

I agree, paint apps are pretty bad with the new line (Hard Drive comes to mind).

 

 

And Snake Eyes WASN'T the acception. Stalker had 4 molds, Cobra Commander 7, Duke 4, Destro 4, Gung-Ho 3, among others. A lot of people like the version 2 Stalker, even though the version 1 is more "classic" Stalker. What about all the people that like the OTHER versions of Snake Eyes over version 2?

 

Yeah, well I just included the 12" stuff to be able to give the collectors of those lines something as well. It does sell... There's too many lines out there to assume it doesn't. However, it's more of a "collector" thing and that's the market they should try and sell it to.

 

And from '82-GI Joe: The Movie, there really wasn't that many versions of characters. That's what I consider the "classic" RAH time as after the movie, it just wasn't that popular anymore. Sales began to drop, the cartoon was relegated to early, early morning status until it was cancelled, and the toys started to become sillier and sillier.

 

That's the time I want to see - I think a lot of non-hard core Joe collectors would agree with me. Sure, you can say "it's time to leave the past behind" but it seems like GI Joe missed the boat on the whole '80s retro thing, so there's still a possibility of bringing them back for a while. I mean, why not?

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Your right about the Joes missing the 80s retro thing.

 

Why not, simply speaking, a "reissue" line like the G1 TF reissues?

 

 

But the rest of your post is part of my point, YOU think the line was best from 82 to 86. Others like it up to 89 and some even to 94. And some actually like the later versions of characters better than the earlier ones. Shouldn't they be counted too? A version of character x (whomever) came out in 1985 and another in 1990. If they choose to make a new sculpt "resemble" the 85 version, those that like the 90 version will be upset. Or, of course, the opposite (making the sculpt resemble the 90 version, the people who like the 85 version will be upset).

 

Also, the line lasted another NINE years after the movie. Granted they weren't the best near the end (93/94), but there were a lot of decent molds and versions of characters. Your saying because YOU don't like the 87-94 molds Hasbro should just ignore them?

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But the rest of your post is part of my point, YOU think the line was best from 82 to 86. Others like it up to 89 and some even to 94. And some actually like the later versions of characters better than the earlier ones. Shouldn't they be counted too? A version of character x (whomever) came out in 1985 and another in 1990. If they choose to make a new sculpt "resemble" the 85 version, those that like the 90 version will be upset. Or, of course, the opposite (making the sculpt resemble the 90 version, the people who like the 85 version will be upset).

 

Also, the line lasted another NINE years after the movie. Granted they weren't the best near the end (93/94), but there were a lot of decent molds and versions of characters. Your saying because YOU don't like the 87-94 molds Hasbro should just ignore them?

 

I'm only making an educated guess here, but based on sales, availability, the show... pretty much anything, nothing after the movie was as popular as it was in the years up to it.

 

Yeah, I do think those were the best years myself, but I think a lot of people would agree with me. There was some good stuff in '88 and '89, but then we started to get Eco Warriors, DEF, Ninja Force, Dino Hunters (?), etc... AND TOO MANY BRIGHT COLOURS!

 

It's high time they got back to the basics. GI Joe doesn't need gimmicks and they don't need bright colours to attract the attention of dim-witted children. Like I said, we're ALMOST there now, but not quite. Yes, this is MY opinion, but I guarantee that a lof of people out there agree with me.

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Oh, I too agree with you. Just playing devil's advocate a bit.

 

I also don't have a problem with the new looks of the new sculpts. Some look better, some worse. Torch, for example, no longer looks like a gay biker. Bazooka, while everyone bemoans the loss of the football jersey, looks better (or at least more appropriate?). Leatherneck, no idea but it ISN'T Leatherneck.

 

And bright colors don't count. Many of those molds could still work with more subdued colors.

 

The only gimmick G.I. Joe (figures) needs is really good articulation and great accessories. But we KNOW that isn't going to be the case, hence AA crap. But I think they could avoid THAT buy how they package the items. For example, the Kamakura vs Night Creeper pack has "With Ninja Action" in a bold splash on the top. What the hell does THAT mean? Nothing. If they would just do innocuous, stupid blurbs like that on the packages, Gung-Ho wouldn't NEED a crappy gear in his back for "knife action" or "punching action" (since they can't figure out WHAT it does). I seriously doubt Walmart gives a crap whether a figure in the pack has some lame gimmick. It is the package itself they care about.

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I also don't have a problem with the new looks of the new sculpts. Some look better, some worse. Torch, for example, no longer looks like a gay biker. Bazooka, while everyone bemoans the loss of the football jersey, looks better (or at least more appropriate?). Leatherneck, no idea but it ISN'T Leatherneck.

 

And bright colors don't count. Many of those molds could still work with more subdued colors.

 

Yeah, I have to agree with you on the Dreadnok thing... the bare midriff thing on guys was a REAL bad choice. And I was going to mention the mold thing as well... I was looking at a lot of the figures in the late '80s-early '90s series and they really could look a lot better with more appropriate paint. This is something that they still have problems with, unfortunately (colour blind... they must be).

 

Oh, I too agree with you. Just playing devil's advocate a bit.

 

Yeah, I thought so. I mean, who doesn't love '82-'86?

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Wow I didn think of so many responses in one night!!!!

 

Yea, maybe I am stuck in the 80's. But oh well. I'll still be here. I mean you guys do like to talk GI JOE don't ya???

 

@loll@

 

Besides I might just hold off a bit, and then get back in full steam once I have a real job with real money!!! Things are tight and only getting tighter!!! I think I was just in a mood earlier!!!

 

And thanks to those that gave me a pep talk, and to those that didn't, just shows the type of person you are.

 

And even Doc who has butted heads with me on many occasion, showed the real nice person he can be, thanks. But don't go changing your name to Doc Good just yet!!! @smilepunch@

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Oh, I too agree with you. Just playing devil's advocate a bit.

 

Yeah, I thought so. I mean, who doesn't love '82-'86?

Actually, I extend it up through 1991. Figures like Bullhorn, Low-light version 3 (version 2 being Slaughter's Marauders), the Night Force figures, Muskrat and Repeater, among others. Many of those figures are just as "classic"as the 82-86 figures. Repeater, for example has a distinct military feel. H.E.A.T.-Viper has a really cool set up that you can imagine only Cobra could create (at least back in the 80s). The much vaunted Night Viper came out in 89.

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Wow I didn think of so many responses in one night!!!!

 

Yea, maybe I am stuck in the 80's. But oh well. I'll still be here. I mean you guys do like to talk GI JOE don't ya???

 

@loll@

 

Besides I might just hold off a bit, and then get back in full steam once I have a real job with real money!!! Things are tight and only getting tighter!!! I think I was just in a mood earlier!!!

 

And thanks to those that gave me a pep talk, and to those that didn't, just shows the type of person you are.

 

And even Doc who has butted heads with me on many occasion, showed the real nice person he can be, thanks. But don't go changing your name to Doc Good just yet!!! @smilepunch@

I know the feeling. There is SO much new stuff coming out by the end of the year, I can't imagine how I'll afford it all. Especially since I collect TFs in addition to Joes.

 

The best advice, of course, is to just buy what you like.

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I have many times wonted out of the Joe Toy World lots of times. Every time I say that, they always come out with something new that drags me screaming “COOL� back in.

 

"When will it stop....the dream’s...the toys....... the psychic visions of thing yet to come."

 

Yep I have truly, truly lost it. You can ask my wife and the guy with neat white Jackets and my kids saying “are we going to get a new daddy and get to have all his cool toys�.

 

Yes I love Joe Toys and my kids do to. I really wish every one got what they won’t out of toys. It's what really keeps us as young as we need to be inside; not forgetting to mention all the cool stuff out there?

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Actually, I extend it up through 1991. Figures like Bullhorn, Low-light version 3 (version 2 being Slaughter's Marauders), the Night Force figures, Muskrat and Repeater, among others. Many of those figures are just as "classic"as the 82-86 figures. Repeater, for example has a distinct military feel. H.E.A.T.-Viper has a really cool set up that you can imagine only Cobra could create (at least back in the 80s). The much vaunted Night Viper came out in 89.

Oh I collected then too, some really grat figures came out. Like Muskrat, Shockwave, one of my faves, TARGAT, The Iron Grenadiers, etc, etc, etc!!! @smilepunch@ Oh and the Night Viper was the greatest!!!!!!!!!!

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Actually, I extend it up through 1991.  Figures like Bullhorn, Low-light version 3 (version 2 being Slaughter's Marauders), the Night Force figures, Muskrat and Repeater, among others.  Many of those figures are just as "classic"as the 82-86 figures.  Repeater, for example has a distinct military feel.  H.E.A.T.-Viper has a really cool set up that you can imagine only Cobra could create (at least back in the 80s).  The much vaunted Night Viper came out in 89.

Oh I collected then too, some really grat figures came out. Like Muskrat, Shockwave, one of my faves, TARGAT, The Iron Grenadiers, etc, etc, etc!!! @smilepunch@ Oh and the Night Viper was the greatest!!!!!!!!!!

And even up through the 91 figures we were still seeing some really cool accessories like Bullhorn's sniper rifle or Red Star's gatling gun.

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