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Why I Support Joe vs. Cobra and other assorted thoughts


ProckoZero_Prime

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your right doc i forgot about the old man post,sorry, that isn't civil either. Now you all seem to be trying to be civil keep it up. State your OPINIONS but don't insult others for theres, either side.

 

And yes lots of ways this line is inferior to rah in my opinion, sound tabs, t-crotchs, neo arms and the occiasional product screw up, but i still like this line for it's postive, new sculpts, great designes, new chars, some good some bad, and definatly the fact that joe is back and hasbro realy seems to me to be improving each wave.

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You can say that you don't like the new joes all you want but you can't call people who do idiots.

 

Uhhhhh . . . which post are you referring to? This one??

 

If you claim to be a Joe fan then turn around and put out THREE Viper repaints with the exact same quality problems IN A ROW, you are either one of two things: A liar or an idiot. And if you beleive them without question, youre the latter.

 

Call me crazy, I don't see that as calling someone an idiot for

"liking" the new Joes at all. I think that if you don't ever question anything, well then isn't that kind of the definition of an "idiot"??

 

But all of that aside, people who complain about the "complainers" is always pretty rich!!

:lol: So, to take a page out of clam's playbook, how about this:

 

"There are a certain handful of posters who shall remain nameless who just can't accept the fact that some people don't love the new line. Lots of people like it, but that's not enough for them. It's fine if you want to express your opinion, but an opinion that I disagree with?? THAT's a TOTALLY different story!! It's totally different to come here and tell me that I'm an idiot if I want to criticize a toy line. I mean, the only thing they want to do is buy every new Joe that comes out, and come on these boards and make fun of everyone who doesn't like them!! What a bunch of jerks!! Don't they have anything better to do than come on here JUST to read our criticisms and get mad because of them? I mean, seriously!! Some people come to these forums and just endlessly #$## and moan about the people who don't like GvsC as much as they do, and it really gets old to read these old men who can't accept other people's opinions and move on; they just whine incessantly about the same things over and over."

 

See how ridiculous THAT reads??

 

And as far as people coming here with solely positive contributions?? Sorry, guys, but you are few and far between. Don't believe me, then check out that "GOOD things about GvsC" thread that I started that died a very quick death . . .

 

And those of us who in your view "#$##" about the new line and "say the same things" over and over are WRONG and are obviously only reading select posts, or reading them with blinders and only seeing what you want to see to get riled up. Every so often new figures come out, and when they do, we talk about those figures specifically!! Until we actually HAVE them, or see pictures of them, we can't really criticize the specific problems, or praise the specific achievements, can we?

 

Bottom line is that no one here who has problems with GvsC is stuck in the past. No one. RAH is better than GvsC, which is pretty much undisputed. True, some of the things they did back then they can't realistically do now, and vice versa.

 

So, let's live in the now. Check out the standards that are set by every other major toy lines, meaning NOT Lanard and all of those other cheap crappy toys. Then check back at the GvsC figures, and they just don't stand up to the other big dogs. Not in hardly ANY way. Right now, the only thing GvsC can say they do better than most lines is in their variety. It's barely a year old, and there's already TONS of figures out, even if you don't count repaints. Few other lines can do that, but at the same rate, you also have to consider the size that they work at compared to other lines as well, so in the end it's not all that praiseworthy.

 

It's nice to know that us "old farts" have some effect on Hasbro's actions, though . . .

 

Otherwise, Wave 1 would have continued to Wave 2, 3, etc. and by Wave 5 or so, by that time, Hasbro could have finally achieved their ultimate goal: parts-swapping with their Star Wars figs. One mold = two lines!! The ultimate in cheap, cost-cutting toy making!!! Ask your rep for more details!!

 

Actually, I shouldn't even say that. Not even Star Wars has as many crappy sloppy paint errors as GvsC . . .

 

Ooops!! There I go bitching again!! @-@

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very well put THO. i think every body thought the line was going to be better than what it is when they first heard that they were bringing g.i joe back. people are disappointed because the expected RAH, not the cheap imitation we got. some people just got over that fact quicker than others. i would have rathered they waited another year to bring us g.i joes if it would have made a diffrence for them to take there time to come up with better ideas for quality and away to sale them. it almost seems like they rushed to bring us this line without doing research of what we want or even what the kids want. it's just my opinion, but i gotta say they probably saw how RAH was still saleing and wanted to hurry up and put something out while the iron was still hot. but what's done is done and all we can do is look at the line as for what it is right now and try to get over the fact that RAH is never comming back but HASBRO has a chance to give us something new and maybe someday (dare i say it) something better than RAH.

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tis all opinions and yes that is what i was reffering to. To me it seems directed towards gvc fans, but it is true that no one should go on without questioning things.

 

gvc isn't better than rah but i realy hope it will be and it is slowly stepping in the right direction.

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I don't know if anyone here knows, but the root of quite a few complaints are the direct action of some of the big retail franchises.

 

The Big 3 (Walmart, Target and Toys R Us) are the main causes of our grievances about the current line.

 

They are resposible for:

 

Sound Attack (and assorted gimmicks: shooting weapons and the like)

2-packs (instead of single-carded figures, so they can sell for a high price point)

Unified Logo

Packaging (the open packages for the Sound Attack features and most likely the limegreen color)

 

 

So it's not ENTIRELY Hasbro's fault. The Big 3 have more influence on how Joe is than some may realize. It's not Hasbro's fault for some of these things, because if they didn't have Sound Attack or came in 2-pack, Walmart wouldn't even carry it. And it is VERY important for Hasbro to appease the Big 3.

 

 

 

But I will say that a few of the bad things about the current line could be fixed on Hasbro's part as they are things they can control. They are:

 

 

*Metal Rivets - maybe once the line picks up more popularity, it'll get a revert back to this.

 

 

*Black Weapons - this is a personal complaint of mine, as I CARE how my Joes are armed. Not metallic brown (like Wave 5), not green, not blue, not yellow or purple... BLACK!!! Or a really dark shards of grey are OK, I guess, but basically.... black! What is wrong with black anyway?!? Hasbro can just stock up on black plastic and be done with it, as far as the weapons are concerned. Backpack colors may vary, but don't get stupid with them either.

 

 

*The Logo - while it sucks that it looks so damn retro, and just plain ugly.... they could at LEAST have the decency to keep it off the vehicles and the figures. Or at the VERY least, keep it off the figures. GI JOE fans, no matter what age, aren't ##$%$#ed. We know which one is the Joe and which one is the Cobra. Maybe if today's kids READ from time to time, they wouldn't piss their pants when Regents exams or the SATs came around (friggin' sad, really). 'Cause it's written clear as day on the filecards.

 

Personally, I don't give a damn what the logo looks like. But when that ugly ass logo is slapped on the Joes, you can say I'm more than a bit concerned about it.

 

Same goes with the packaging. It could be limegreen for all I care (which it already is), it goes into the trash were it belongs... ironically. :wink: I'm no MOC collector so into the trash it goes. They can blast the damn packaging with all the logos they want, I don't care. Just keep it off the figures, and if possible... the vehicles.

 

 

*The paint jobs - Some of these are questionable. It'd be great if they had some dark colors or even better CAMOUFLAGE. You know? The stuff military personnel wear into combat? What a concept, huh? GI JOE looking like military personnel...

 

Anyway... you can't hardly go wrong with dark colors like black, blues and greys, and even camouflage. I'll say it again: CAMOUFLAGE. They don't even have to think. Just go buy a bunch of Army t-shirts and slap the patterns, and/or a variation of it, onto the Joes. Or look at some of the past RAH patterns and colors and imitate them, or a slight variation of.

 

 

*Sculpts - some of the sculpt could be better. Giving Zartan hydraulics assisted, bionic exoskeletal arms is a little out there (and limegreen no less :roll: ). They should fit the a little of the character's personality more sometimes. Especially those who have their own customized wardrobe (IE. Not military uniforms/fatigues).

 

(Wave 5 looks to have corrected some of this. For the most part, they look good. Thanks to Tom-1 for the pics!)

 

 

 

 

These are small fixes. VERY small. All are fixable with almost NO effort on Hasbro's part (except the metal rivets thing). Something that can be done that wouldn't even upset the almighty Big 3. So get your ass in gear Hasbro!

 

So far, one of the things that Hasbro has done right is how they added Sound Attack to the recent TRU RAH vehicle repaints. Just unscrew 4 screws and you're done. Not bad. You get a RAH vehicle and can remove that crap, and it's basically the same vehicle. I hope they continue with TRU RAH Vehicle and Figure Exclusives.

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Wow, that was an awesome post, 8speed. And really true... I forget that myself sometimes... that the major retail chains are in many ways Hasbro's slave masters...

 

And welcome to ADC! :)

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actuatly i don't want them to turn back to metal rivits, cause then they porpitions would change again! i would like them to use harder plastic, Hear that doc evil? but the metal would cost money and alter the look of the line.

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I concur with Nas.

I have said this since the beginning, for those of you who think I'm nothing but an RAH psycho... I LIKE JvC. I LIKE the new sculpts. Do I think it's better than RAH? Not really, but it is new and my attention is kept by new things, not repaints or slight remolds of something I have had for years...

 

I have spent too much money on army building and general collecting for them to totally rearrange the design of these JvC toys by adding metal rivets. You want a seperate, high-quality line of Joes just like RAH? I'm all for it, no question about that - but JvC should stay as is, especially after seeing wave 5 really kick the crap out of all previous waves.

 

Tom

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Wow, that was an awesome post, 8speed. And really true... I forget that myself sometimes... that the major retail chains are in many ways Hasbro's slave masters...

 

And welcome to ADC! :)

 

Thanks! :)

 

 

 

actuatly i don't want them to turn back to metal rivits, cause then they porpitions would change again! i would like them to use harder plastic, Hear that doc evil? but the metal would cost money and alter the look of the line.
I concur with Nas.  

I have said this since the beginning, for those of you who think I'm nothing but an RAH psycho... I LIKE JvC. I LIKE the new sculpts. Do I think it's better than RAH? Not really, but it is new and my attention is kept by new things, not repaints or slight remolds of something I have had for years...

 

I have spent too much money on army building and general collecting for them to totally rearrange the design of these JvC toys by adding metal rivets. You want a seperate, high-quality line of Joes just like RAH? I'm all for it, no question about that - but JvC should stay as is, especially after seeing wave 5 really kick the crap out of all previous waves.

 

Tom

 

I guess we can agree to disagree on these points. BUT I will say while the metal rivets will probably change the proportions some, the positive is that they'll just fit into the vehicles better.

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I guess we can agree to disagree on these points. BUT I will say while the metal rivets will probably change the proportions some, the positive is that they'll just fit into the vehicles better.

 

Agreed, but what Hasbro really needs to do is stop re-using other toy lines' molds (RAH, Johnny Quest) and start making actual GOOD NEW vehicles tailor-made for GvsC.

 

Oh . . . and the Big 3??? @!#$% %@#$%# , ya corporate nazis!

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I guess we can agree to disagree on these points. BUT I will say while the metal rivets will probably change the proportions some, the positive is that they'll just fit into the vehicles better.

 

Agreed, but what Hasbro really needs to do is stop re-using other toy lines' molds (RAH, Johnny Quest) and start making actual GOOD NEW vehicles tailor-made for GvsC.

 

Oh . . . and the Big 3??? @!#$% %@#$%# , ya corporate nazis!

Well, the NAC was a JvC vehicle. But it feels like only the pilot's seat is comfortable for JvC (even then its Wave 2 and beyond). The NAC's backseats and cargo bay seat are way more comfortable for RAH molds.

 

 

And I'm still for RAH repaints (vehicles and figures), as they are the only Joes I go after 110%. If a JvC figure comes out that I want is on the shelf, it will ALWAYS be in the "if I don't have to buy anything else I'll pick it up" category.

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Was visiting good ol' General Joes" site, and reading some of his recent reviews and newest editions to his dio-story, when this picture of his Dart with some of the older RAH Joes kinda struck me and got me to noticing some things I hadn't given the JvC line much credit for, but when compared to (at least these examples of) older figures, this Dart really does have some great sculpting and nice realistic details to him (Sling Blade looking expression aside 8) )

 

The use of metal rivets again, would imo be a PLUS for sure, as I really don't like the oversized shoulders and ape-ish arms, that ALL seem to need armbands on them. But nevertheless, this figure looks very good, and when standing next to Spirit and Airborne like his is here...DANG! He looks GREAT!

 

I'm in agreement with 8speed on all he listed as needed "improvements" or the little things that will still make an even BIGGER difference on the line..

metal rivets..Black weapons..paint jobs..sculpts and the logo (mostly NOT being applied to the vehicles or figures) but I still think the toys are fun, and look pretty cool, and are desired still yet by this Joe junkie, but a DEMANDING kinda picky Joe junkie is all. :wink:

 

Again, this pic is from General Joes site and this pic is a pretty good illustration of what I was describing..I think 8)

 

dartwave4-3.jpg

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I would really appreciate the return of metal rivets. They would help the figures have much better proportions and added durability. Even with the softer plastic, the figures would be better with metal rivets. And for all you who say that it wouldn't be better, why? Do you have a problem with quality? So what, they would change the way GvC looks.

 

Well guess what, Every Single wave of GvC figures looks much different from the rest. Having better proportions from now on would not hurt the line, and it would help them fit in with RAH.

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Hey VH--

 

While that pic is cool, and I definitely like Dart a lot, I still think they way over-did it. It's sort of the same thing with the MOTU revamp, although done much better in an aesthetic design way than GvsC.

 

And that is, that the designers looked too closely at the old RAH figures and tried to nit-pick them too much saying things like:

 

"The skin is way too pale."

"The heads are too big for the bodies."

"The eyes are never painted in."

"The body types are too similar."

"The chest and arms are all too scrawny."

 

So, granted, these are legitimate criticisms of the old RAH figs, but just because they are legitimate doesn't mean that you pull a total 180 and make ALL of the figures tanned, pin-headed, and super-buff with gargantuan limbs.

 

With a lot of the stuff, it's the whole if it ain't broke . . .

 

Ya know what I mean?

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Hey VH--

 

While that pic is cool, and I definitely like Dart a lot, I still think they way over-did it.  It's sort of the same thing with the MOTU revamp, although done much better in an aesthetic design way than GvsC.

 

And that is, that the designers looked too closely at the old RAH figures and tried to nit-pick them too much saying things like:

 

"The skin is way too pale."

"The heads are too big for the bodies."

"The eyes are never painted in."

"The body types are too similar."

"The chest and arms are all too scrawny."

 

So, granted, these are legitimate criticisms of the old RAH figs, but just because they are legitimate doesn't mean that you pull a total 180 and make ALL of the figures tanned, pin-headed, and super-buff with gargantuan limbs.

 

With a lot of the stuff, it's the whole if it ain't broke . . .

 

Ya know what I mean?

 

Certainly! :) I would have been one that probably would have nit-picked at those very same issues, you mentioned above about the RAH figures. I love the added detail on the stuff (since the 2000 waves) with the eyes painted in, and the skin tones on them were VERY pale before and although ORANGE isn't a particularly appealing subsitution for "pale", the other skin tones are definitely better.

 

A little variance in some body sizes and heights doesn't bother me either, much less a concern than I use to have with the figures that should have been much larger and hulking compared to the other Joes, and ended up the very same size (ie Roadpig, Sgt Slaughter, Roadblock) I like some larger than normal figures, just for the visual "realness" of it...like the Bats and IG's or even Shipwreck being a bit more hulking. 8)

 

Heads being "too big" remedied with heads being too small, and "scrawny" appendages being replaced with oversized bulging..from plastic rivets..shoulders, is NOT the best way to go either..I AGREE! 180 degrees is definitely too far and a little drastic! :wink:

 

That happy medium, is in there somewhere, and although I don't have wave 5 yet, I think some of these issues are still being looked at, and already starting to show up in the newest waves.

 

Nothing of these complaints is enough to keep me from collecting them..as is..for now, knowing that there are still changes being made to them, and i'll be the first to let everyone know what I like and dislike for sure. The logo change is crap, the logo's on the vehicles and even figures is CRAPPIER, but that still won't keep me from getting the cool toys as I see'em, but I always have opinions on the stuff as it comes out.

 

2-packs vs single packs

packaging designs

logo designs

weapon choices

color choices

wacky proportions

repaints

figureless vehicles

repaint figures in vehicles

"exclusives"

"VERSUS" period!

classic character appearances (Recondo for one)

"gimmicks"

availability

non-availabilty

etc..ect...

 

These will ALWAYS be issues of debate, much discussion and critique, with many a different viewpoints to be certain. I'm thinking the line is looking better, but I won't hold back my opinion of what's out, to MYSELF so as NOT to offend some Hasbro backers. it's as simple a hobby and usualyy follows this pattern for some...

 

Collect...examine (play) and share! And by share, I mean all thoughts as to waht we think of everything.

 

Geeesh..were was I..? Oh yeah, I AGREE...ARAH wasn't broke, however, I always thought some better things could be done with it, and although we strayed off a bit with waves 1 thru 3 1/2...it's looking promising. :D

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The main thing here is we want it to return to what Hasbro once had, a sense of quality.

 

I'll admit, I was a fool in buying wave 1, because I saw the GI Joe logo. Doc, you described me well, picking up anything that had the Joe name. I missed the opportunity with the classics and re-issues, so I thought I could redeem my collection.Once I saw 1.5 and the later waves, I knew then that Hasbro f-ed up in its quality department.

 

Do I buy the line? Yes. I like a few characters in their that would be good for my collection. As I said, I missed out on a lot of the classic Joes and want to integrate some of the new ones that have some what of a likeness in RAH.

 

Do I have poor tast?, No. I do not think I do. I am satisfied with what I see NOW ans what is availible to me, the lost Joe boy who gets a second chance who cannot but would like to go and get the classics off of eBay. Hell, I do buy a few classics at an antique store if the price is right.

 

Do I know it can get better? Yes, it can. I want betterfigures and a return to what I did have a glimpse at as a little kid, and I am seeing a slow and gradual improvement each time.

 

I guess you can call me more forgiving but I do want better and will continue to push for more quality each time I write a letter to ole Hasbro (2 right now, 1 more pending).

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So it's not ENTIRELY Hasbro's fault. The Big 3 have more influence on how Joe is than some may realize. It's not Hasbro's fault for some of these things, because if they didn't have Sound Attack or came in 2-pack, Walmart wouldn't even carry it. And it is VERY important for Hasbro to appease the Big 3.

 

I'll say it again, why the hell is a retail chain(s) telling a manufactuerer what to do? Hasbro is the one that knows the fan demand, not the f-ing stores. Don't they think that ole Hasbro is familiar with the demand and popularity? Once more, it is the manufactuerer's job to determine what to make, how it is to be made, the retailers only sell it.Bussiness is a risk, so don't go f-ing around in the manufactuerer's gig, cause they don't want to loose the gamble either?

 

And since when has the Big 3 determined what I would like? Are they firggin psychic? Obviously not. So go screw yourselves ya corporate @$$e$ who probobly never played with Joes, Star Wars, MOTU or LOTR before.

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HEEEL...HECK YEAH DANGIT!!! :x

 

What Forcehunter said!

 

As a matter of fact, I'm running over to TRU tonight yet, so I may just walk up to a manager and say "here....take this to the BIG BOSS!" and...

 

KAAA-POW!!!! right in the ugly kisser!

 

"Tell'em Luca Brazi sleeps with duh fishes, if they don't leave duh toy makers alone to do what they do best..MAKE TOYS, and dey shoulds do what dey do's best....SHADDAP ABOUT IT!" @-@

 

 

:wink:

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unfortantly the chains will dictate intell enough people do yell at them. The have the power to carry the product and the toy bussiness is amazingly dirty,... d*wm corporate america!

 

And as far as the vehicles go most it was becouse they were molded for another line but the nac was just bad thinking,... arg. But they seemed to have fixed it with the newer stuff (though most of it still crappy)

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Yeah most of the vehicles look like they're from a cartoonie cartoon, not a GI Joe series. The wave 5 vehicles do look better, but still the road to improvment still expands. I'm only going to pick up the jet, and the two vehics that come with figs (cause i need more Vipers and I love Grunt even with the ball joint).

 

Give the retailers hell? Okay I like that. What dio you suggest? I can't really boycott em. Anyone got the big 3's addresses? I'm sure I can get TRUs, but I dunno about the others.

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There is one way for fans to boycott the 'big three' as it's called now. Buy from on-line stores, and if possible, ones that are geared towards serving GI Joe fans.

 

Would it make a big impact on the retail chains if we all as a community turned to buy from on-line shops and not spend our toy money there? probably not, but it couldn't hurt.

 

Tom

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There is one way for fans to boycott the 'big three' as it's called now. Buy from on-line stores, and if possible, ones that are geared towards serving GI Joe fans.  

 

Would it make a big impact on the retail chains if we all as a community turned to buy from on-line shops and not spend our toy money there? probably not, but it couldn't hurt.  

 

Tom

 

I don't know if that will even help. Hell, it might even hurt. The thing is, the Big 3 AND Hasbro have to know what the fans (both young and old) want and like. Just boycotting buying Joes at the retail stores might be sending the message that there are no Joe fans at all, and if the Big 3 don't see a need to support the line, then this Joe line will get cancelled too. At least this is what I suspect might be a possibility.

 

At any rate, things like Sound Attack and 2-packs are required. They are a neccessary evil. I can understand that. Hell, I can even live with it, for the most part. BUT the way Hasbro executes these mandatory features just blows. Specifically with Sound Attack. I doubt the Big 3 affect the design and what toys actually come out. They just have influence on packaging and what gimmicks, if at all, the toy needs, and how many of them should be included (Wave 5 has both Sound Attack AND Spy Troops).

 

Whoever Hasbro hired to design these toys needs to flip through an actual military vehicles, weapons, outfits and gear book. Also whoever's approving these things need to have his head examined too. JvC is still in its infancy, so when ugly ass vehicles and figure designs come out and are actually manufactured and put in toy stores, it certainly doesn't help the "cause."

 

 

A VERY simple solutions would be:

 

Instead of ruining every damn personal weapon and weapon in general with a Sound Attack tab, why not include one of the Sound Attack weapons that come with the vehicles instead? Instead of having a Sound Attack rifle and a SA pistol... why not include 1 NAC gatling gun? Who wouldn't want another one of these babies to attach to the vehicles that have MULTIPLE extra SA ports? Its damn sure way better that putting Cobra Commanders Sound Attack Serpent Staff into your NAC.

 

This, to me, would at least be an acceptable way of implementing Sound Attack, and not have it be so damn intrusive on the figures. On the vehicles is another matter.

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Would it make a big impact on the retail chains if we all as a community turned to buy from on-line shops and not spend our toy money there? probably not, but it couldn't hurt.  

 

 

 

 

What speed said, plus it will be hard on the wallet. They charge more plus shipping. The online stores are good as a last resort and getting figs that are discontinued, but not for brand new stuff.

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I dont see Sound Attack as neccessary at all. If RAH could last for over a decade WITHOUT cheap quality degrading electronic gimmicks, (For the most part at least) then so can JvC. This sint debatable. History has proven this fact right. If making sounds ourselves was good enough for us, it's good enough for the kids of today. Come on Hasbro, treat us like we have BRAINS for once.

 

Nonetheless, I like your idea of making the Crap Attack weapons actual armaments for the vehicles much better. Hell, pack a missle or two or some gatling gun with Crap Attack with each 2-pack.

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Yeah, I don't see why "gimmicks" are necessary for "The Big 3" (what a lame industry :roll: ) to stock them.

 

Spider-Man toys mostly do not have a whole lot gimmicks really. LOTR figs have no gimmicks as far as I know, and these are still carried. I mean, what exactly do they want by a gimmick? Guns that shoot, that kind of thing?

 

I know why they want something like that, and that's to make people want to buy the small things (Mini-Cons, Joe figues, He-Man figures) to "interact" with the big things (Optimus Prime, NAC, Castle Greyskull). But really, I mean how many people here own a lot of GvsC figs, and not one vehicle? I have yet to buy any vehicle under the GvsC moniker, and I probably have a good 50 or so figs at least!

 

Same thing with Castle Greyskull! With a hefty price tag like that, not everyone who buys the figs owns a Greyskull. People are going to buy the smaller figures for almost every line no matter what, since once they get to that stage they have at least some sort of following. To sell the bigger, higher-priced items, don't rely on jacking up the smaller things to do it!! For example, with MOTU, you don't even notice the sound chip on the foot. Same with the Simpsons figures to go with the Playsets. Can't see 'em unless you look on the bottom of their feet. With GvsC and TF: Armada, you've got these big-ass sound tabs on the guns, and these weird looking holes and pegs sticking out of every Armada toy. What a joke.

 

8speed's definitely on the right track. Encourage people to want to buy BOTH, without screwing up the design. Voices, like on the Simpsons figures, wouldn't work with GvsC, because they don't got no goddamn cartoon yet!!!! Otherwise, it'd be GREAT! Imagine getting a Chris Latta sound-alike do to Cobra Commander? As for how they'd do it, maybe put them on the side of one of the legs, or on one of the feet, or whatever. Hey, I'm not the toy designer here, so THEY should figure it out. Just lose the fricking sound tabs on the guns!!!

 

And then if you still REALLY want those lame gun-shooting sounds for the vehicles also, keep it how it is, with the buttons, and the included SA weapons. The vehicle weapons aren't really meant to be used other than ON the vehicle, right? So it shouldn't matter that it looks stupid when it's off of the sound port.

 

And speaking of retailers dictating toy content, if that had anything to do with why RAH went to crap in the 1990's, well, then another "%@!!@ off!!" right back at ya, retailers!!!

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