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Why I Support Joe vs. Cobra and other assorted thoughts


ProckoZero_Prime

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Before I begin, I'm going to be honest...I've only been active in the Joe online community since April of this year, and only in the Devil's Due and Sgt. Savage forums. That being said, I am very surprised at the extreme distaste numerous posters here feel for the new Joe vs Cobra line of GI Joe.

 

Four years ago, as near as I can tell, Hasbro released some figures under the old mold concept...and they were crappy. Later on, they released the last full run of the original old-school style figures...and they were ok, but to be honest, they didn't hold up to the originals, cool repaint jobs or not (i.e. Serpentor, Shock Viper, Duke, Firefly.)

 

We finally got a new GI Joe product under the title Joe vs. Cobra...and the first wave of figures had no o-rings. Were they bad figures? No, they weren't...but they weren't "GI Joe" to many collectors because of the no O-ring factor. There are still a plethora of these figures left on the shelves in my area; I would presume part of this is due to the fact that my area has more older Joe fans than kids who are into the product.

 

With subsequent waves, we have seen Hasbro re-tool the figures originally intended to NOT have the O-ring in order to make a lot of crotchety folks happy...and it was good. We got IMO the coolest repaint of the Viper ever in the black/purple combo, some sweet Alley Viper army building material, along with some pretty solid figures in Stalker, Scarlett, Flint, Baroness, Blowtorch, Snow Serpent, Dr. Mindbender, o-ring Cobra Commander, and especially the black Snake Eyes. With wave 4 hitting, we've gotten to see some ridiculously cool new figures in the new Duke, Ripper, Shipwreck, Wild Bill, o-ring CLAWS, Dart, o-ring Neo Viper, and yes, the new BAT (yes, I miss the swivel arms, but I love the coloration and chest-panel removal feature and am quite happy with the figure as a whole.) With the Spy Troops line coming up, we have seen in pictures what appears to be an unbelievable job and some great new characters along with it.

 

Some people seem to believe that since they aren't the original old-style molds, they can't be GI Joe. As hard as I've tried, I just can't understand this rationale. I don't know if it is because there are official acronyms that one just doesn't feel apply to the new figures or what. I don't know if it is because you lost your Skidmark figure when you were 9 and now espouse vitriolic comments across random places. What I do know is this: Hasbro is not bringing back the old-school molds in full force; too many retailers (apparently) have said they will not carry these figures en masse. I'm not saying that "the only real GI Joe fans are the ones buying the new figures and everyone who isn't is full of donkey poop." I'm saying that a growing majority of the GI Joe community is letting themselves enjoy the new line of GI Joe figures for what they are: the new line of GI Joe figures. They're the same characters that many of us grew up with, and like it or not, nearly all of the figures are now being created in similar form as their predecessors were (i.e. Dr. Mindbender, Flint, Baroness, Snow Serpent, Scarlett, etc etc.) Furthermore, many of the figures are very well sculpted and quite frankly, just look cool.

 

That's my opinion...and I stand to it. Hopefully some of the folks here will eventually realize that the only thing pissing and moaning accomplishes is raising people's blood pressure, and hardly ever changes people's viewpoints.

 

Excelsior!

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That's my opinion...and I stand to it. Hopefully some of the folks here will eventually realize that the only thing pissing and moaning accomplishes is raising people's blood pressure, and hardly ever changes people's viewpoints.

 

I don't think anyone REALLY posts their opinions (usually) to try and "change peoples viewpoints" although some good points brought up might inevitably change them in the end, for the worse or better, depending on which side of the fence your making those "points" for.

 

We're all just making comments for the sake of discussion in this here discussion forum, and with something as involved as the G.I.Joe toys and story is...it makes for A LOT of varying discussions to be sure.

 

What people get all excited and worked up about, is when their comments are lumped into some type of category or group, usually consisting of the classifications of "naysayers" or "drooling Hasbro fanboys" or even worse names ocassionally. 8)

 

I find the different opinions interesting and like to come here for that reason, but I could care less if somebody doesn't totally agree with me on something or even ANYTHING about...umm..well, TOYS! :roll: Just as long as they don't try to generalize me somehow over MY differing viewpoints.

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i like the new GVC line. in fact i love it--its the only thing i collect besides MOTU and the occasional Mcfarlane gory stuff.

 

People are going to have their opinions and thats just the way it is. I played with gi joes 15 years ago and loved it. i only had a few though and they all got sold . so im not a die hard "this must be that way and this other thing must be this certain way" like some other joe fans are, but i can see exactly why they would be that way. if its something youve had and collected and loved for so long, and they changes come along that are wierd and not thot out well, you have the right to be mad.

 

but overall i think many ppl on this board liek the new Joes, and hasbro has done better to improve them recently. its just those certain few crabby types [which is probly the same 2 guys acting like 10 anyway] who make it seem like its really bad.

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thank you so much ProckoZero_Prime for coming here to post your thoughts. i know how people have noticed how negative this forum has gotten. this has always been my favorite website on the net for all toys. we always get great scoops on joes. but most of the people on this forum tend to act like spoiled brats. nothing will ever make them happy. i wish they gave the new line a chance. alas while americandreamcomics.com is a good place to find out scoops on the gvc line, it is not a good place to come to if you want to discuss your thankfulness that a dedicated team is trying to continue the legacy. you will just get flamed on by a bunch of old men.

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Howdy neighbor! :D Welcome to ADC!

 

You're right, this general sentiment here is pretty much the exact opposite of the Devil's Due board. But you know what? It's good for you. ;) Seriously, I haven't been at DD very long, but I've seen some people follow Hasbro's latest schemes so blindly it's scary. :o And yes, on the flip side there are always going to be people who you're never going to please, and there are a bunch of them here, but it's good to get both opinions on an issue. 8)

 

And there are people who like GvC here... they tend to be quieter, but they exist! Really! :lol:

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Very nicely said ProckoZero_Prime, and I agree with you. There are alot of naysayers and so forth on here but hey, their opinion should not matter to you. If you like GvC, cool and if not, then dont buy it and quit complaining, thats how I see it. Sure, some of the early figs had some problems (coughcoughDestrocough) but they're getting better in each wave. Look at Waves 2 and so forth, we've got a cool Sgt. Stalker, Firefly, Snow Serpent, Flint, Baroness, Dr. Mindbender, B.A.T., Ship Wreck, Ripper, Snake Eyes, Cobra Commander, Wild Bill, Beach Head, and Scarlet (wave 4). And some of the figs Hasbro goofed on early are fixes later like Scarlet, Zartan, and Snake Eyes in Waves 3 and up. And so far, we're getting a pretty good product.

 

But when some ppl say that the new figs should look like some of the older ones, I think "what the hell are the thinking?" I've seen some of the older figs and many are butt-ugly. So im just glad that they have brand new looks to some of our fav characters.

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ProckoZero_Prime...you just became my best friend here :D Very nicely done!

 

i know how people have noticed how negative this forum has gotten.

 

That it has.

 

we always get great scoops on joes.

 

That we do.

 

but most of the people on this forum tend to act like spoiled brats.  nothing will ever make them happy. alas while americandreamcomics.com is a good place to find out scoops on the gvc line, it is not a good place to come to if you want to discuss your thankfulness that a dedicated team is trying to continue the legacy.  you will just get flamed on by a bunch of old men.

 

Admiral, I'm glad I'm not the only one that thinks this. You couldn't have been more right. It seems that out off the 5-6 forums I read here, the Joe forum is the worst.

 

I find the different opinions interesting.

 

Opinions yes, endless bitching from the same handful of people about the same thing each time....no.

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       If you like GvC, cool and if not, then dont buy it and quit complaining, thats how I see it.

 

That ideal is flat out wrong. If it was that way, this board would be dead. Because when you ask one side of the discussion to stop posting their opinions, you also have to do so for the other.

 

I could say "if you do like them, then go ahead and buy them, but don't post here your compliments of them."

 

See how dumb that sounds? If you have a right to say that you like them, than you must respect everyone else's right to say that they don't.

 

 

It seems like the people that do like GvC are the only ones who complain about a person's righ to voice their opinion. Whenever I see someone post something I disagree with, I never try to get them to stop posting their opinions. No matter what I think about GvC, I respect everyone's right to post whether they like it or not, and I would never ask someone to stop posting what they think. That is not right, and you should stop doing so.

 

 

If you like it, say so, but don't ask me to stop saying that I don't like it.

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It seems like the people that do like GvC are the only ones who complain about a person's righ to voice their opinion.

 

Opinions, yes, they are welcome, but there are a select few here and elsewhere that do nothing but #$#@# about the same things over and over.

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I'm suprised at how civil this has been, good job guys lol. No seriously both sides have there opinions and should keep posting them it's the personal insults that are too far and this is the worst forum on the entire board for that. But the reason we are passionat is becouse we love joes, knowing that we share this obssesion (literaly in a lot of cases lol) we should have respect for each other.

 

I am personaly all for the new line and do agree too that there still many problems with but with every wave it seems to improve cept sound tabs, always crappy arg!

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I am very surprised at the extreme distaste numerous posters here feel for the new Joe vs Cobra line of GI Joe.

 

That's what happens when a lower quality product comes out. People who know better dont like it. No respectable teacher will accept lower academic performance from a child when they KNOW theyre capable of doing better

 

Four years ago, as near as I can tell, Hasbro released some figures under the old mold concept...and they were crappy.

 

I think not. Despite some admitted minor detailing issues and skin tones, they were quite well done. Some in fact were even better color-wise to their original versions.

 

We finally got a new GI Joe product under the title Joe vs. Cobra...and the first wave of figures had no o-rings. Were they bad figures? No, they weren't...but they weren't "GI Joe"  to many collectors because of the no O-ring factor.

 

They might not have been bad figures for OTHER lines, but they WERE bad JOE figures. Not just the o-ring was the reason. These had huge, bulky, badly proportioned body parts that were incompatible with other Joe figures. And most importantly, they just didnt LOOK like the characters they were supposed to be. Destro is to sophisticated to wear a mask like looks like he's trying to poop out a hedgehog. Gung-Ho should have been named Stone Cold. The vehicles were either changed up badly with superfluous missle launchers, just plain had bad colors, or both. The vehicle drivers paint jobs were half-assed and sometimes didnt fit well inside their own vehicles. Then there were the chronically overused weapons.

 

While few ever approved of the lack of o-rings, there were many OTHER logical, valid reasons not to be satisfied. They wern't considered "GI Joes" to many collectors becasue they simply WEREN'T figures that lived up to the quality of their namesakes.

 

 

There are still a plethora of these figures left on the shelves in my area; I would presume part of this is due to the fact that my area has more older Joe fans than kids who are into the product.

 

More likely people discovered they suck. The first few shipments actually sold out initially.

 

With subsequent waves, we have seen Hasbro re-tool the figures originally intended to NOT have the O-ring in order to make a lot of crotchety folks happy...and it was good.

 

Correction: BETTER, not good. Issues with proportions, plastic quality and gimmicks still remain.

 

We got IMO the coolest repaint of the Viper ever in the black/purple combo,

 

You think flesh colored gloves and pants the same color as the boots is COOL?

 

some sweet Alley Viper army building material,

 

Admittedly, both versions WERE quite good. In fact most of the RAH repaints in the line were really nice. But thats because they hail from a day that knew HOW a proper Joe figure SHOULD be built.

 

 

along with some pretty solid figures in Stalker, Scarlett, Flint, Baroness, Blowtorch, Snow Serpent, Dr. Mindbender, o-ring Cobra Commander, and especially the black Snake Eyes.

 

Scarlett was too gawky, Flint had disproportionate head and legs, and Snow Serpent had a tiny head for someone wearing a helmet. The rest had decent costume designs, but were crippled by the aforementioned quality issues

 

 

 

Some people seem to believe that since they aren't the original old-style molds, they can't be GI Joe. As hard as I've tried, I just can't understand this rationale.

 

Maybe you can understand this. You know how most movies like "Wild Wild West" or "Charlie's Angel's" are generally considered not as good as the original television show? Its because that despite advances in filmaking technology since their TV days may have improved, it the finished product lacks the heart of it's namesake. Names can only go a certain distance.

 

I don't know if it is because there are official acronyms that one just doesn't feel apply to the new figures or what. I don't know if it is because you lost your Skidmark figure when you were 9 and now espouse vitriolic comments across random places.

 

Simply requesting Hasbro live up to their own standards is not vitriol. Its wanting the line to be the best it can possibly be. While you may be willing to accept whatever is plopped in your lap with no question some people have respect for a line that has earned their love for two decades.

 

I'm saying that a growing majority of the GI Joe community is letting themselves enjoy the new line of GI Joe figures for what they are: the new line of GI Joe figures.

 

Morre accurately there are simply a growing number of people too complacent with mediocrity. This line is jsut Joe in name only.

 

They're the same characters that many of us grew up with, and like it or not, nearly all of the figures are now being created in similar form as their predecessors were (i.e. Dr. Mindbender, Flint, Baroness, Snow Serpent, Scarlett, etc etc.)

 

I like that they keep some elements of their characteristic outfits, but that doesnt change the fact that the figures are built with soft bendy plastic.

 

Furthermore, many of the figures are very well sculpted and quite frankly, just look cool.

 

Sculpt shmulpt. Todd McFarlane's "figures" have rather incredible sculpting as well, but thats about all they have going for them. There are still quality control issues with them as well. But a fancy design must never blind one to serious quality control issues that need to be corrected before the line can ever hope to become truly anything other than Joe in name only.

 

That's my opinion...and I stand to it. Hopefully some of the folks here will eventually realize that the only thing pissing and moaning accomplishes is raising people's blood pressure, and hardly ever changes people's viewpoints.

 

Correction once again. Its not bitching and moaning. Its giving a damn for something we loved and not settling for anything simply beacuse it has GI Joes name on it. Its wanting a 20 year old pop culture phenomonae to recieve the respect it deserves. Its having enough respect for kids AND collectors to wnat them to have a higher quality product and not be taken in simply by some flashy sculpting.

 

 

 

 

 

but most of the people on this forum tend to act like spoiled brats.

 

While others will take anything shat into their mouths all too eagerly and happily beg for more

 

 

nothing will ever make them happy.

 

Au contraire, I for one will be happy when Hasbro

 

-makes the toys out of good plastic

-use realistic skin tones.

-produce arms using metal rivets and make all parts compatible with older style figures.

-make vehicles that dont look like carnival rides and dispense with needless cost raising gimmicks

-Bring back the logo that is as much a part of the 3 3/4" indentity as characters like Snake-Eyes

 

This is not something hard for them to do. In fact they were doing it for twelve years. It's still as good a recipe for quality toys today as it was then. Quality is timeless. You can sculpt all new stuff with as much detail without rediculously bulking things up.

 

i wish they gave the new line a chance.

 

The reason Im so critical is because I *DID* give them a chance. And they blew it. There have been a few small improvements over the past couple waves but many things still remain

 

alas while americandreamcomics.com is a good place to find out scoops on the gvc line, it is not a good place to come to if you want to discuss your thankfulness that a dedicated team is trying to continue the legacy. you will just get flamed on by a bunch of old men.

 

Dedicated to continue the legacy?

 

:lol:

 

Wow. Can I have some of what youve been smoking? If your lords and masters at Hasbro were so concerned with continuing the legacy they would not have cheapened the line like they have and not turned it into so much mindless kiddee fare. All they are dedicated to about is getting something put on the shelves. If you claim to be a Joe fan then turn around and put out THREE Viper repaints with the exact same quality problems IN A ROW, you are either one of two things: A liar or an idiot. And if you beleive them without question, youre the latter.

 

And you can spout that "Its for the kids" load of Barbara Striesand till you're blue in the face. Children of today can have every bit, if not MORE fun with a non-electronic vehicle with exclusive figure than they can with some cheap half-assed toy with a battery draining electronic gimmick. The fact that RAH lasted for over a decade makes this fact inarguable. If it was good enough for US to have had fun with it then its good enough for them.

 

We deserve a better product. And Hasbro CAN make it. But they choose NOT too thinking that there are enough drooling fanboys who will buy any Joe product no matter HOW half-assed it may be simply because it has the Joe label. And God help us all, it looks like theyre right.

 

And I will *NEVER* shut up about insisting kids and collectors alike can have a product both can enjoy. It CAN happen. But untill then all the sweet words from a corporate stoolie about respecting the line are nothing more than just that. WORDS.

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Before I begin, I'm going to be honest...I've only been active in the Joe online community since April of this year, and only in the Devil's Due and Sgt. Savage forums. That being said, I am very surprised at the extreme distaste numerous posters here feel for the new Joe vs Cobra line of GI Joe.

 

if you are anything like me, after you've spent 20 years of your money i'm surprised you don't understand why a bunch of loyal g.i joe collectors would expect more from a line that they help keep alive while others thought it was dead and gone and all washed up. you cannot deny that the line is inferior to RAH, i don't care what you say about snake eyes and his "cool" ankle joints. if you want to hear surprising, i was very surprised that hasbro would choose to bring back the greatest action figure ever created in the cheapest form for action figures from a major toy line i've seen in along time. if they didn't have the name g.i joe on the package i would swear they were from "THE SOLDIER" toy line. granted, some of them are cool and i buy what i like. but nobody can honestly say that they didn't expect this line to be better when they first heard about it. i think a major portion of collectors were very disapointed in the line and it's just taking some of us longer to get over it.

 

and what i'm tired of is people saying they are tired of people complaining about the line. dude, it's a forum, look it up if you don't understand the meaning. we are here to discuss g.ijoes, what we like and what we don't like point blank. this isn't a HASBRO FAN club site, we are not here to chear them on all the time and pat them on the back. if i don't like something i'm gonna voice my opinion and who ever don't like it ,when you see my name don't read my post.

 

what alot of people are not understanding is that we love g.i joe so much we can't stand for it to be lesser than what it was. it's not about the "changes" they made, but about the quality. i mean can anyone say honestly that the quality is good , even on your best figure i bet there is something about it you don't like. so are we just suppose to throw our hands in the air and say "oh well, atleast we got g.i joes" and not look at the obvious faults that the line has? another thing i find surprising is that any fellow collector doesn't expect or demand more out of this line.

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You can say that you don't like the new joes all you want but you can't call people who do idiots. I know you love joes but so does everyone else, don't make me lock another thread. COOL IT NOW! State your opinions and your facts make sure you don't think they are same thing.

 

Remeber this is a discussion forum, not your an idiot if you don't agree with what i say forum, that's why lots of members of the joe forum post 3 times and then run away or don't post that much.

 

So i'll once again say it simply, Cool it, you are warned.

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I'll just make a quick post here, to defend the ADC Joe forum as a whole, as it seems to have been labeled as a bit of an "Anti-Joe" type of group or something negative in it's collection of posters here.

 

I love this forum and enjoy the shared conversations and interaction with it's many members, and it actually ADDS to the enjoyment of my hobby as a result. I've posted in other forums and have no complaints about them as such, but I DO enjoy the ADC forums very much and don't necessarily agree with the "negative" label it's getting in this thread. There are just as many "negative" posts and grumblings of the same nature about the JvC line at all the other message boards, from what I've seen anyway.

 

There are indeed a few more characters here at this forum, but I like the mix and mesh and wide variety of opinions as much as I do the look and style of the board itself.

 

Hats off to JayC! :D

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Oh and crap like "Spoiled brats" "Old men" and "Nothing will ever make them happy" is a-ok I suppose, huh? Now THAT is vitriol.

 

 

I kind of noticed that too Doc! :wink:

 

Makes me hesitate to express my honest opinions about things like sound attack or extra swivel joints or the different look of the figures proportions and the new logo style and whatever else gets a new concept thrown at it, for us to come here and observe and then comment on.

 

If I'm not exactly pleased with it all, I might be considered an "old man spoiled on the old toys and not very happy about it", so my presence isn't appreciated. 8)

 

See how easy it is to flip the coin, on who is making WHO uncomfortable in their posting of their opinions? :wink:

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Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that when Doc Evil comes into a civil thread it starts going the other direction? Ban me if you must, but that's just my observation.

 

Civil? *IM* not the one who started it up with the "old man" crap, pally. I guess you just conveniently IGNORED that little fact. And guess WHAT? Statements like THAT arent exactly civil either.

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but most of the people on this forum tend to act like spoiled brats. nothing will ever make them happy. alas while americandreamcomics.com is a good place to find out scoops on the gvc line, it is not a good place to come to if you want to discuss your thankfulness that a dedicated team is trying to continue the legacy. you will just get flamed on by a bunch of old men

 

amen

 

 

this forum was once good back before the new board came along this was my first place to post at when i came into the joe online rings and now its nothing more than a tourant of bitching moaning and insults

 

 

:roll:

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Well, if there are so many people complaining about how the board is dominated by b*tchers and moaners...

 

Why not do something about it and try and even the odds?

 

I'm not making fun of you, I'm serious. 8) If so many people are 'dissapointed' with the way the GI Joe forum has been lately, why not try and make a difference? Be a little more vigorous in your arguments, while keeping them civil... give everybody something to think about.

 

...Instead of complaining about all the complaining. :lol: ;)

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this forum was once good back before the new board came along this was my first place to post at when i came into the joe online rings and now its nothing more than a tourant of bitching moaning and insults

 

 

And of course you would consider yourself ABOVE all that "bitching and moaning and insults" with a statement like that? :roll:

 

You sound like a RAH fan now....wishing for the glory days of how things "once" were! Of course when they suggest things aren't as good as they once were, they're just "bitching and moaning"!

 

If this was Sunday church, I suppose we shouldn't be asking any inappropriate questions and shaking the faith of the group, with any comments of doubt, but since it's only about toys and stuff, I don't see the need to break down and fall apart over somebody elses objections.

 

Geesh! get a GRIP people! If Doc Evil (just one example of who I think your all referring to) was taking over the marketing department at Hasbro and telling us what HE was going to do with them NOW...that would be one thing (if you felt his ideas were all wrong for it) but for cryin' out loud....he's only another fan and collector who has some major objections (granted a bit more than most) but nevertheless, it's more likely that whatever it is that you like that he doesn't, will stay the same, and his wishes are sunk and yours are going on!

 

Who's the person with the advantage here? Least the naysayers get, is an opportunity to voice their feelings about it, whereas the fans have it just the way they like it. Grow a spine and let'em vent a little ay? :-? [/i]

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       If you like GvC, cool and if not, then dont buy it and quit complaining, thats how I see it.

 

That ideal is flat out wrong. If it was that way, this board would be dead. Because when you ask one side of the discussion to stop posting their opinions, you also have to do so for the other.

 

I could say "if you do like them, then go ahead and buy them, but don't post here your compliments of them."

 

See how dumb that sounds? If you have a right to say that you like them, than you must respect everyone else's right to say that they don't.

 

 

It seems like the people that do like GvC are the only ones who complain about a person's righ to voice their opinion. Whenever I see someone post something I disagree with, I never try to get them to stop posting their opinions. No matter what I think about GvC, I respect everyone's right to post whether they like it or not, and I would never ask someone to stop posting what they think. That is not right, and you should stop doing so.

 

 

If you like it, say so, but don't ask me to stop saying that I don't like it.

 

Sorry you feel that way about me clam. I'm just stating an idea of mine and I get the lecture. Meh, but thats not important. Anyway, I'm not saying that people dont have the right to say whatever they want because they do. Someone on here could say that i'm a no good c**k sucker who should get the hell out of here because they can say that if they want to, I just wouldnt care. Hahah, anyway, my statement was directed to all those people out there who have nothing better to do but buy a wave of GvC, complain and moan about it, and then keep buying each wave after that just so they can complain about GvC further. I cant tell you how many times I've seen someone say on here that they absolutely hated the 1st wave of GvC and would never buy any more again yet they keep buying the newer waves just to complain about them and point out what they dont like over and over again. I dont come on here to see people compalin about the same things over and over again, I come on here to talk to/meet new people and read other people's opinions, as long as they're kept in moderation and aren't seriously repetitive.

So if someone wants to complain about GvC, go ahead, more power to them. If they want to say something positive about GvC, even better, good to hear some positive things about this line. So the voicing of one's opinions are fine with me, just dont keep rambling on about the stuff you dont like about it all the time. Those people should just stop buying the line if they hate it so much and move on with their lives.

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